Sexual orientation in Scotland, 2017

They only find it disgusting because they have imagined doing it themselves and either been horrified at the prospect as it turns their stomach, or more likely horrified as the thought keeps entering their head!

 

In evolution, it is natural that a certain percentage of offspring will not be natural! Being unnatural, is natural....in nature!

 

Drivel.

Why shouldn't a homosexual couple be allowed to adopt and raise a child? I'm sure if you gave a child with junkie parents who treat them like * the choice they'd go with the couple every day of the week.

Why shouldn't they marry? What difference to your life does it make? Can't you allow them to be happy and do as they please so long as it doesn't hurt anyone?

Homophobic * fry my brain. It just makes no sense.

 

Explain how it isnt natural?

One is far more common of course but doesnt mean the other is less natural.

 

I have to be honest and admit i still havent come to terms with the idea of 2 guys adopting or creating a child. It shouldnt be about them wanting to feel complete, it should be all about the child, and therefore, in my mind, in particular gay males, should not be allowed to adopt children.

Yes i know they may make better parents than x% of heterosexial couples, but that isnt the point.

 

I tried to give a * once . . . nearly broke my back doing it.

 

Yes it is. If they can do a better job of taking care of a child and raising a child then there's nothing wrong with it whatsoever.

 

Using the argument that there are a certain percentage of heteros who are bad parents or junkies etc is not a good enough argument. Too small a percentage of people are like that, and gays are just as likely to be bad parents as non gays. If it was a straight choice between bad hetero and good gay couple, than obviously you would choose the good gay couple, but it is never that simple a choice in reality.

 

While I agree with you that adoption should always be about the child, in regards to you're point about feeling complete, surely that applies to straight couples as well?

I mean it pretty much goes without saying that that no one, gay or straight, should have/adopt a child for the sake of it or because they feel that it's something people in a relationship should do. More to the point, I don't understand your logic of how male couples, or perhaps gay couples in general, can only approach the process of surrogacy/adoption with purely selfish intentions. Does that mean heterosexual couples that can't have children naturally are also only interested in adoption/surrogacy for selfish reasons? (Apologies, if i'm misinterpreting you there)

At the end of the day, surely in the case of adoption all that should really matter is that the couple in question would make good parents, that they can afford to look after the child and that the child would be brought up in a safe and loving environment. If the couple that fit that criteria happen to be straight, that's fine. If they happen to be gay, that's also fine.

 

Well i understand your point and i probably was alluding to the idea they are only being selfish, but for me, although a gay couple may well make good parents, the facts are that we all know how hard it is to go through school and childhood without being picked on or bullied....we all try and fit in. And given that there are no long term studies which can ably disprove that the children of gay (men in particular)couples will not receive a lot of abuse and hardship specifically because of their 'parents', i personally dont think it is worth the experiment, given how many hetero couples there are who want to adopt.

Hetero couples who cant conceive, should in my opinion be seen more sympathetically. Whilst i may have made fun of the the idea that being gay is unnatural (above), the fact is that they are in an extreme minority, and given that the last thing a kid wants at school is to stand out, i think the more natural option should always be taken. (providing they are deemed suitable)

I do not like the idea of any same * couple having kids, but i am far more open to the idea of 2 women having kids, simply because they are mothers, and mothers are definitely more important than fathers. (generally speaking of course) For me, 2 guys wanting a kid is just a case of wanting your cake and eat it...they are being selfish. They are not taking into consideration the impact it will have on the childs life...they are taking a chance, and i dont think it is theirs to take.

 

While I respect your opinion, I just can't agree with any of that.

I'll admit the bullying thing was something that has crossed my mind in the past (and something I was actually going to touch on in my last post) but we can't just accept bigotry and use it as an excuse. We should be addressing and challenging these attitudes from an early age with the aim of producing a more tolerant society (which seems to be happening to some degree).

I'm sure plenty would have argued against people adopting or fostering children of different race than their own, and yet we've seen that that can be a success. I don't see why the same thing can't happen with homosexual parents. Giving in to bigotry, which is what this ultimately is, and treating homosexual couples as second class citizens isn't an acceptable answer in a modern society.

 

I dont think it is bigotry. I wouldnt deny gay men any single right, other than this. For every rule there is an exception, and for me, trying to shoehorn society into a way of thinking just to prove tolerance is crazy. It is experimenting with the children to prove a point....and i dont think we as a society need to get over this particular hurdle just to prove we are not bigoted.

It may be unfair of me to say this, but i just dont trust men with kids the way i would women. Who in here would let their babysitter be a man?

 

Statistically mothers are much more likely to harm their children than fathers.

Recent studies show that children growing up in a fatherless homes are much more likely to have behavioral problems , increased chance of substance abuse , more chance of going to jail and more likely to kill themselves. Now alot of that im sure is due to being looked after by a single parent who will struggle a bit more to raise their child.

But it also shows how important it is for young kids to have good male role models.

I get what your saying though, instinctively you would feel much better leaving your kids with a women especially if you dont know the person very well.

 

Actually agree with MGM for once. What's happened to me

 

Young lads these days spend too much time in front of the mirror. A young apprentice came to work first day on my site with a * 7 piece manicure set in his bag, a comb, lip balm and a pocket mirror! He wasn't even ashamed of it either

 

What 'problems' have you faced due to gay people wanting to marry and wanting equality in law? Unless you are gay I would guess not a single one. I find it really odd when people who are not impacted by such issues are so vocal in objecting to other peoples choices and their stuggle for equality.

On the 'natural' argument, its a weird one to me because 1. Homosexual relations have been around as long as human civilisations 2. Homosexuality is evident in nature throughout the animal kingdom, and 3. Lots of things that do happen in nature are considered morally wrong when adopted by humans so I dont understand why being 'natural' is considered a gold standard of morality in this debate.

 

This is just blatant discrimination.

 

My Sister and her partner married and adopted. All three (them and the kid) seem fairly normal.

Compare that to some families I know who are anything but normal yet are in heterosexual relationships.

So what is normal exactly?

 

Sadly we live in a world where there is an abundance of unwanted children. The debate surely isnt is 2 men adopting a child more appropriate or better for that child than a man and a woman. It has to be 'is two men adopting a child better for that child than the child spending its life in care or on the street'. It is surely a no brainer.

On the side, as regards suitability, Id guess that statistically parents who adopt (gay or straight) are better than biological parents simply because every one of them must be motivated to look after a child. The average biological parent will be pulled down by the millions of parents who dont give a * about looking after their kids.

 

I used to look at all these people posting about gay rights and thought to myself "why are these people complaining ? They get treated the same as everyone else in society nowadays"

Then I come on here and see how backwards people still are. As fans of our club who know all about the history of anti-Irish discrimination in this country, it shows the selfish nature of people in society.

As long as I'm ok and can do what I want.