1. Having trouble logging in by clicking the link at the top right of the page? Click here to be taken to the log in page.
    Dismiss Notice

Scott Brown What now?

Discussion in 'Celtic Chat' started by ellboy, Apr 16, 2008.

Discuss Scott Brown What now? in the Celtic Chat area at TalkCeltic.net.

  1. Paul67 Administrator Administrator

    Joined:
    Jan 17, 2007
    Messages:
    42,377
    Likes Received:
    8,742
    Fav Celtic Song:
    Let The People Sing
    We can only go on what is going on at Celtic, and Brown, at the moment, is not doing enough.

    At Hibs, he had Thomson and Beuzellin covering the deeper areas, giving him the license to burst forward.

    He doesn't have that here, and his own personal game is suffering for it, but we can't change our formation to accomodate one player.

    Maybe he would do better playing with Hartley, but the point remains, he has not done enough to shift Robson or Hartley from the team just now, it would be unfair on both of them as they are doing well.
     
  2. cat123

    Joined:
    Jan 18, 2007
    Messages:
    3,241
    Likes Received:
    526
    Fav Celtic Player:
    Tom Rogic
    Fav Celtic Song:
    The Fields Of Athenry
    Brown will be a success at CP, he is in the managers long term plans and he'll be in the long term plans of any other manager we get. The guy has a great reputation and just because he hasn't played that great recently isn't going to change it.

    Next season I think he will be a star for us, he has showed glipses this season but I think all he is missing is a bit of belief because hes young and it hasn't went as well as he would have hoped.
     
  3. Paul67 Administrator Administrator

    Joined:
    Jan 17, 2007
    Messages:
    42,377
    Likes Received:
    8,742
    Fav Celtic Song:
    Let The People Sing
    Strachan is on record as saying he never wanted Gravesen to be a defensive midfielder, and your right, Gravesen did offer a lot going forward, but even forward thinking midfield players need discipline to get into defensive areas, and he refused to carry out instructions, hence he became a non team player.
     
  4. gary b

    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2007
    Messages:
    1,879
    Likes Received:
    0
    I would agree that Brown might play better with Hartley,and they did link up well when we beat Aberdeen 5-1,only for Hartley to be dropped for the following game.We all have different views on Brown's abilities,but the fact remains he hasnt lived up to his price tag so far.As you said earlier,why change a winning combination.Robson deserves his chance.
     
  5. lubo#1

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2007
    Messages:
    1,770
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Gourock
    Fav Celtic Player:
    Boruc & McGeady
    Fav Celtic Song:
    Fields of Athenry
    Paul i agree with the main point, if robson hatrtley is going good run with it.

    But, if GS changes it when brown is available, it'll tell me he Brown is playing to instruction, and doing a great job in Strachans eyes.

    We should also remember robson can play LM, Hartley can play RM as can Brown, Aidan and naka shouldn't be automatic picks either.
     
  6. Paul67 Administrator Administrator

    Joined:
    Jan 17, 2007
    Messages:
    42,377
    Likes Received:
    8,742
    Fav Celtic Song:
    Let The People Sing
    I'm a firm believer in the guy on form getting a start, and keeping his place until such time it needs changing, and your right, Hartley should have kept his place after Aberdeen, and it's the case now that Robson and Hartley should be the pairing due to form.

    Spot on with the price tag, I think it has had an affect on his game.
     
  7. ellboy

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2007
    Messages:
    4,062
    Likes Received:
    1
    Fav Celtic Player:
    BOBO,AIDEN,ATRUR,NAKA
    You have proof of this.?

    As to me it was just down to him not being able to carry out defensive instructions. As like most of our midfielders they are more used to playing as a three than a four. The diference between Grav and his replacements is there age. Grav is too long in the tooth to change his game and Strachen should have known this prior to buying him. Play Grav in his favoured formation and podition and he would be an asset perhaps the same could be said about Brown and a few others also.
     
  8. Paul67 Administrator Administrator

    Joined:
    Jan 17, 2007
    Messages:
    42,377
    Likes Received:
    8,742
    Fav Celtic Song:
    Let The People Sing
    That's why I said in a previous post that my fear is Brown will walk back into the side. I think WGS lets himself down by showing favouritism towards certain players, Hesselink at times, Donati until it has become glaringly obvious, and Brown, being the cases.
     
  9. kennydal

    Joined:
    Jan 30, 2008
    Messages:
    29,485
    Likes Received:
    2
    scott brown can play in the next huns game, do you play him
     
  10. Paul67 Administrator Administrator

    Joined:
    Jan 17, 2007
    Messages:
    42,377
    Likes Received:
    8,742
    Fav Celtic Song:
    Let The People Sing
    His performances, and obvious poor positional sense, and number of starts would suggest it to the eye, coupled with the managers comments about him (why would you not believe that).

    If a player can't alter his game through age, or to a different formation, then they should not be playing football imo.

    It may not be their preferred position, but they should have the tactical know how to do so.
     
  11. ellboy

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2007
    Messages:
    4,062
    Likes Received:
    1
    Fav Celtic Player:
    BOBO,AIDEN,ATRUR,NAKA
    Their was obviously a spat between the two of them and Grav was made to look the villain as WGS held all the aces. I genuinly feel Strachen tried to make him look bad just so he could get him of the wage bill to free up some wages for a new player. As I said earlier I think to ask an older pro to change his game was a bit un-reasonable.

    Not trying to be smart but in essence if Bobo was asked to play CM and looked lost he shouldn´t be playing football in your opinion.?
    BTW I havent gone completely of my nut as I know he not playing. I was just using him as an obvious example of a player who is stuck to his position.

    It is not really fair to criticise a player if he dosen´t have it in his locker to play an alien position. Grav has played as a combative midfield player in front of two defensive holding players almost his whole career. Their is a big difference in playing that position than being asked to play a deeper more diciplined role.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 17, 2008
  12. lubo#1

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2007
    Messages:
    1,770
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Gourock
    Fav Celtic Player:
    Boruc & McGeady
    Fav Celtic Song:
    Fields of Athenry
    wasn't that the reason he was sold by real as they thought they had purchased a defensive midfeilder? surely strachan was aware of this.
     
  13. Paul67 Administrator Administrator

    Joined:
    Jan 17, 2007
    Messages:
    42,377
    Likes Received:
    8,742
    Fav Celtic Song:
    Let The People Sing
    Your suggestion about Bobo is just daft Ellboy, and cannot be used as a comparison to the point about Gravesen.

    Are you actually saying that certain central midfield players should not be expected to perform defensive duties, even if they are attacking midfielders?

    An alien position? He was asked to play in the position which he prefers, which is attacking midfielder, but he did not carry out the defensive side that a midfielder, attacking or holding, should carry out.

    At no point was Gravesen dropped from the team for refusing to play as a holding midfielder.
     
  14. CelticUtd

    Joined:
    Mar 15, 2008
    Messages:
    1,723
    Likes Received:
    0
    Fav Celtic Song:
    You'll Never Walk Alone
    "At no point was Gravesen dropped from the team for refusing to play as a holding midfielder"

    Well put mate
     
  15. Renegade T

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2005
    Messages:
    18,483
    Likes Received:
    4
    Location:
    The Green Room
    Fav Celtic Player:
    Diego Samaradona
    Agreed with Paul67 , i dunno how some of yous even disagree , leaves me dumbfounded at times reading the over reactions on here , fukn madness
     
  16. ellboy

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2007
    Messages:
    4,062
    Likes Received:
    1
    Fav Celtic Player:
    BOBO,AIDEN,ATRUR,NAKA
    I used Bobo as it is obvious the big man is nothing else other than a CB.

    I am not saying certain players should be exempt from doing there defensive duties. I just think some players should not be relied upon as if it is their natural vocation IMO WGS tried to do this laterly with Grav as he asked him to sit more than to support the forwards.

    The second highlighted sentance I cant agree on. He was not asked to play his prefered position he was asked get forward and to protect the back four in essence to play box to box which is just not his game. He is an all action combative midfielder who makes the tempo of a game and keeps the oposition defenders under preasure. Not someone who will mop up everything like a Lenny.

    Your last point I am not saying he was told to sit as a holding midfield player I just think for 45K a week WGS thought he was getting the complete midfield player and when he realised he hadn´t. He told Grav to play more diciplined and not to press the game further up the park (his natural game). This is what I mean by alien to him and I believe WGS new this and left him out to dry. Hence the spat.

    P.S. Lubo yes you are right Madrid thought they were getting a DM player also and that is the reason he was sold on as he was never going to play instead of a Raul for example.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 17, 2008
  17. CelticUtd

    Joined:
    Mar 15, 2008
    Messages:
    1,723
    Likes Received:
    0
    Fav Celtic Song:
    You'll Never Walk Alone
    I think the crux of the matter is that Robson and Hartley are the best midfield two we have. Why? They are the best. Robson is a great sigin by WGS and Hartley I feel is one of this season unsung heros.

    Forget your Browns, Sno and Donati they two should be the first team.
     
  18. Chappie

    Joined:
    May 26, 2005
    Messages:
    3,395
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Madrid
    Fav Celtic Player:
    Boruc, Maloney
    Fav Celtic Song:
    YNWA, Willie Maley
    Gravesen never listened to instructions. He's a loose cannon who put the shape of the team in jeopardy. Strachan was perfectly within his rights as manager to drop him. Some signings work, some don't. Any talk of a spat between the two is pure speculation.

    Gravesen is a player who is capable of tough tackling, and he should have learned to adapt to Celtic's system, not the other way round.

    Look at Paul Hartley, a great attacking player for Hearts, scored plenty of goals. Comes to Celtic, gets asked to play in our system and he has adapted without complaint and has given it his all. The sign of a good team player.
     
  19. ellboy

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2007
    Messages:
    4,062
    Likes Received:
    1
    Fav Celtic Player:
    BOBO,AIDEN,ATRUR,NAKA
    Do you think Lenny would have been a good Attacking Midfield player if he was instructed to play that way.?
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 18, 2008
  20. mmmikey

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2005
    Messages:
    7,776
    Likes Received:
    27
    Fav Celtic Player:
    McStay, Moravcik, Di Canio, LARSSON!
    Good work on twisting that into another 'Strachan lucky' rather than 'Strachan good decision' mate. :50::50::50::50::50::50::50: