Rocco Vata

But you said you had an idea, which was the bit I was asking about to confirm if that is the case:

Several people mention this sort of thing but it all sounds like made up rumours/gossip. So am just wondering if your take is any different?

I'm not particularly comfortable with how the club/Rodgers are handling the squad, including development of players and making sure we long term have the right quality. Not specific to Vata but I would really like to see us take more of a chance on developing players from the academy. All the recent managers, particularly Ange and Rodgers I'd say, have let us down there. That means not bloating the squad so there is space for them.

 

Summers was in around a few squads last season played a few games. Frame has played this season so there is some sort of pathway it’s dependent on the manager and the young players themselves to show that they can play consistently in the first team.

how many youth players who have left us have ripped it up? We talk about quality yet some of the youth who left us are playing lower leagues etc so it’s well and good saying give them a chance but they have to be good enough for the level

 

Has he not been training with the forst team squad? I though he had been until he rejected a deal, could be wrong. I would like us to at least utilise the 5 game rule with some players, give some of them at least a couple of 30 min sub appearances to see if they can do anything. A loan for him would be the best option is he signs a new deal.

 

Not 100% sure mate. He was training at one point for sure. Not signing a new contract shouldn't be why we don't include someone in the squad if they are going to improve it. Which I think Vata would have at points this season, we've struggled on the right wing big time. Should be better with Abada back though.

 

I hear what you are saying however, it’s the fan base,100% myself included, that are the majority of the reason so few get a chance. We demand success, we demand to be better than the Huns which stops young guys getting a chance. We cannot drop a point but there is a complete overreaction and meltdown. We are not a club that can give youngsters a chance to come in and play their way into it, we don’t allow it.
Personally I’d scrap our academy because we must spend millions on it with very very little return.

 

I'm at the opposite end of that, but fair enough. Agree with your take on how people perceive it but for me its a real opportunity lost. Gone are the days were we are seriously competing in the transfer market so we need to use all avenues to improve our quality is how I personally see it.

 

Don’t understand why he would sign a new deal now with 8 wingers ahead of him.

He’s had one foot out the door for 6 months now, I wonder what has changed to offer him a new deal.

 

Difficult to say whether he would have improved us or not but just like not loaning in other teams youth players without a buy clause you don't want to be improving what will eventually be another teams player and like most say on here we would be better giving that chance to a young Celtic player who is committed. Aye with any luck Abada hits form

 

Summers and frame have equally had far too little a chance at the squad.

Again, the chances guys like Yang are getting should be afforded to the younger lads like Vata, Summers etc. That's an acceptable amount of hame time to give to our own 18 year olds to bring them on.


As I've said elsewhere, the sheer number of players attempting to make it, means the vast majority of players will not make it. That's a given. But we aren't helping these lads at all.
Yes we can look at the likes of dembele now slumbing it at Blackpool, but even then he's got 20 games, two goals and 8 assists. For a 20 year old that's bad his career stiffled for at least two seasons here, that's not actually all that bad.

For context, Yang a 21 year old is 17 appearances, 1 goal and 1 assist for us.

On paper, even Karamoko Dembele looks better right now.

That's just cherry picking this current season though and two players. It's not actually giving the true sense of the situation at Celtic, which is more the fact that these lads aren't given the chance at all at the club, we instead spend money on guys like Yang and Tilio (and truly no offence to either), who are posting number/stats and performances that are extremely questionable, in favour of our own youth.

I'd imagine if we had given Vata 17 appearances so far this season, he would have scored and assisted at least one for each - possibly more (he's 15 appearances and 12 goals in the lowland league, for the record).


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But we can give Yang chances?
Guys like Vata should be getting those game times behind 4 (2 for each side) other wingers. Not relegating guys like Vata to around 8th choice and basically showing them they have no chance to break in to the side.

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I do agree with you to a certain extent. For example there’s no way a player so technically challenged as Maeda should be in our team ahead of an academy player.

 

We were all led to believe he’s turned down a new contract. So there is absolutely no way he should be in front of a player who has signed a long term deal, fact.

 

the point on giving minutes to our best young players instead of our worst first team players is so important to show there’s a pathway there.

instead of throwing away money on 1-2m punts hoping that mud sticks at some point, surely you can give a Vata for example 20 minutes at home to Ross County?

if they are not deemed good enough to the point they are a liability to that degree, we may as well pack the youth system in.

 

This is my issue, why does Tilio get 30 minutes when we are 4 up at home to Hibs? it's mental! It doesn't even need to be Vata. None of them are getting chances.

Not giving the current lads chances just makes the younger ones leave even younger.

For people thinking Karamoko has found his level. He has a goal contribution every other game, he's 20. He's showing what he could have done for us I think.

 

Believed to be turned down because of lack of opportunities to develop and get game time.

Either way though, why are we now returning to that table?
This is another question needing asked of how we are dealing with these situations.

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Absolutely spot on lads.

No one get us wrong here, Yang is here and we would all love to see him do well now that he is here. But he shouldn't have been signed in the first place. Him and Tilio stiffle the development of guys like Vata (or any other).

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Yeah we can't say why play them they want out. Why do the best ones all want to leave? Many will be Celtic fans and would love to stay at Celtic but they have to think about their career. We say bad attitude, but is it a bad attitude to want development at work?

 

My guess is we are struggling to get a striker in this window and Vata is now our back up just in case.

 

Screams of it.

We can't sign someone of real quality to push Kyogo, so we now make sound bites about how we really only need a young talent for a few weeks. And now offer Vata a new chance.
No doubt it he signs we will claim it as a major extension and champion it to the nth degree.

Like a new signing eh.

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I was thinking more along the lines of MJ and Abada and maybe Yang on loan might be the reason