Olympics 2024

I’ve actually changed my opinion on the boxing situation, having read more into it.

Competitive advantage in sport due to genetic differences is a thing. Every Olympic athlete we see is genetically more predisposed to their sport than you or I would be to that same sport. You can take it a step further and even look at genetic advantage within sports (Michael Phelps ridiculous wingspan, for example).

The person in question was born a women, and simply has a higher than average level of testosterone. Testosterone is a massive chemical advantage in sports - so much so that it often forms the basis of any PED cycle. Even among men, having more testosterone is a huge advantage…and people do have naturally varying levels of testosterone.

It’s a very interesting discussion because we’re all pretty comfortable with chemical enhancement. Messi was enhanced at a young age, to ensure the * version of him was bigger, stronger, faster etc than he would others or be. Rightly so, as it resulted in a massive improvement in his life even away from football superstardom, but weighed up against the situation faced by a woman with a naturally high level of testosterone…one is definitely more ‘natural’ than the other.

I would also point out that she has (and this is only what I’ve read online) 5 stoppage wins in around 50 fights, and the Italian woman hadn’t been stopped in about 80. 5 stoppage wins in 50 fights is not the record of a man levelling a bunch of overmatched women. Having watched the bout, I think the Italian lass has taken an exit here.

The reality is, the easy answer here is simply to stop her competing against women, and limit how much testosterone women in professional sports (particularly combat sports) can have, for the benefit of the vast majority. At the same time, there needs to be an acceptance that’s it’s a very unfair grounds on which to stop someone competing. She’s not trying to game the system - she simply has more genetic advantages than people are comfortable.

 

Good sensible post. The whole thing which had disgusted me about the situation is that people have yet again blamed trans people and because of that they have labelled her as a man because everyone on Twitter is so obsessed with chromosomes.

It’s very telling when you look at the accounts which we’re posting the hate. And I thought people had come to their conclusions that trans people don’t exist and it wasn’t possible for someone to go from one gender to another. But in this case it’s possible? Just because it fits into a convenient smear campaign to accelerate their hatred. That’s all I’m saying on the matter.

 

Yeah it’s a separate thread entirely, but there no easy solution.

There are people (here included) that insist that there is only ever man or woman, but cases like this and Semenya’s (and a wealth of scientific evidence) demonstrate that it’s a complex situation. They’re not athletes trying to exploit anything and shouldn’t be treated as such, and there should definitely not be any vitriol aimed at the trans community because if it, but that’s its own agenda altogether.

Anyway, sad to see Murray bow out, but what an amazing career. Equally blessed and unfortunate to share an era with Federer, Djokovic, and Nadal.

 

I've been trying to get my head around this as my twitter feed has been full of the chat. The nuance that has been overlooked in this discussion is that unlike the trans debates, this is a purely biological debate. Some of which I understand but all of which is best left to experts. It's very complex biology that impacts a tiny number of people and it's very tough to try and separate what is an advantage due to biological * and what is just a biological advantage. People are way off framing the argument as a trans things - that's something very different and far easier to apply logic rather than science to in my opinion.

 

Ffs if she was born with a * n ovaries then she's a woman. Don't care if she's naturly juiced up to her eyeballs. I doubt you'd get banned from swimming if you have size 20 webbed feet so acted like big * off cheating flippers. So I have no problem with her.

Obviously, I'm dead against an ex man who grew up as a guy with big muscle producing baws on him before deciding he wants to play dress up to beat up woman. This however isn't the case. So crack on and probably still won't win the gold, but part of me wants her to just for the fox outrage.

 

Yeah it’s a very nuanced and interesting discussion.

Her last fight definitely shone a spotlight on the whole discussion, but I lean towards thinking the Italian girl was making a statement, as opposed to just being completely overwhelmed by the punching power by someone who has stopped approx 10% of her opponents, and lost 9 times in 51 bouts.

As you say, it’s difficult to say how much of an advantage she has (clearly not as much as a CIS/full male) and how it compares to the genetic advantages we’re all comfortable with, enjoyed by elite athletes like Phelps, Byles, or the huge basketballer. They are all genetically close to perfect for their respective sports/positions.

But probably best kept for another thread, as it feels like a topic in its own right. She’s odds on favourite to win gold now, so will be interesting to see how it unfolds.

 

I think Josh Kerr will get a Scottish Gold Medal in the 1500m and tonight Duncan Scott a silver in the swimming for Scotland. And Gemma Reekie will sneak a bronze in the 800 metres for Scotland , oh and Laura Muir , a silver in the 1500m, why not for Scotland

 

If that is accurate then I agree.

 

The whole of the olympics,,is a shambles from the first hour

 

Why can women not have a genetic advantage but men can?

If she's lost to 9 other women, are they then also subject to questionable levels of test?

 

Hope you’re right about them all mate. Duncan Scott silver was spot on

 

Just been watching cheating * henry who’s manager of French team at Olympics, they’re playing the racist Argentinian team, sport, you’ve got to love it

 

Watched a bit of show jumping there, the horses are incredible. Commentator mentioned how ‘special’ it was that one of the british riders competing had a father who competed in 2012, WTFUCK, on which planet is nepotism, privilege and insular entitlement ‘special’, no mention of their whipping colleague either, who’d have thought …

 

* yir Olympics!

 

See another dude won in the women's boxing.
What a shambles

 

Who?

 

Glad Henry and France won then.

Can’t still be greeting about that handball.

 

Lin Yu Ting from Taiwan