Muhammad Ali

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oPaxQUYpg_s[/ame]

 

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F30t-weDqko[/ame]

 

Maybe you should just call him Cassius Clay,if it makes things easier for you.

 

That's fair enough pal.


Serious question though, do you do that with Gascoigne too? I'm not meaning to pry or anything, it's just that both were incredible in their respective sports, but had/have very questionable views and did very questionable things.

I always try to view the person as a whole, personally. Hence sullying my views on Tyson somewhat.

 

The connection with George Foreman truly cemented Ali's (sporting) legacy. Foreman was a genuine beast... he was destroying everything that was being put in front of him (including prime Joe Frazier). Ali was slowing down and he wasn't given a chance. But we know what happened that night in Zaire!

George Foreman could have gone on to be The Greatest - he really was THAT awesome, but Ali took something from him and George's career stalled. Fast forward 10 years and a 40+ year old, generally out-of-shape Foreman gathers himself again as a fighter and returned to torment many of the players of the second heavyweight golden-era in the 90's. Never underestimate how formidable Big George was! Think it's pretty much accepted now that Tyson was terrified of (old) Foreman.

And Ali BEAT that monster!

 

It's so amazing because Foreman was seen as one of the biggest hitters of all time, apparently when folk seen him practising on a heavy bag they would be transfixed at the huge dents he would make in it.

Edit: Didn't see scootz' post. Yeah even more powerful than Tyson from all accounts wow.

 

Ive wrote this out a few times now and deleted it, as i cant find the words to do his life or his passing, justice.......i just know how incredibly sad i am today. I am however quite relieved his suffering is over.

 

I actually think Ali was quite jealous and unsettled by Frazier. Smokin' Joe was respected by all as both a fighter and a man, a guy who carried himself with respect and pride.

Ali preached hate for a lot of his life, and when he was faced by a fellow black man who was twice the man he was he simply couldn't handle it and became the lowest of the low in attacking his status as a black man in America during that period.

Due to the taunts and insults Frazier suffered numerous death threats, and his kids suffered terribly at the hands of bullies for years.

According to Ali, the man who had campaigned on his behalf when Ali was banned from boxing, who helped him out during tough times financially with money and with help promotionally, was an "uncle Tom, a gorilla, dumb, the other type of negro and was, in his words "worse than the enemy, the white man" in his eyes.

In short, he was a *, and he never, ever apologised to Frazier man to man for what he said and did during that era.

For me, this is "the greatest ever" boxer as far as character and respect goes. A guy who still ran his gym in a run-down part of Deebo almost until his death from cancer, where he'd help keep troubled kids off the streets;

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uB9hKqOKO3M[/ame]

Frazier said in later years that it's kind of ironic that a man who chatted so much hate and who tore down Frazier eventually lost the ability to speak at all.

He was right.

 

Gazza does not have strong opinions:smiley-laughing002: He's just an addict that craves attention. I don't agree with Ali racial politics but he was a product of his society and did more good than bad.

 

he made the best grills hahaa

 

I cant even be bothered to attempt to have a go at that, but right now is not the time to try, and your post is inappropriate at best.

 

Ali was brainwashed, like many African Americans, to follow the * spouted by the Nation of Islam. However, many African Americans, including Muhammad Ali and Malcolm X, moved on from this group into more traditional forms of Islam, which are less exclusive when it comes to race.

 

You can't have a go at it, because everything I've said is true. Like I said earlier, he was a great boxer and I certainly feel for his family, but to pretend like he was a terrific person when he wasn't is more inappropriate than anything else.

When someone dies you don't just forget their flaws, especially when those flaws were pretty serious.

 

Feel the same. Cried this morning when I heard. R.I.P. the greatest sportsman EVER.

 

When we were kings good documentry .
http://topdocumentaryfilms.com/when-we-were-kings/

Champions forever.
[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ejVLwkI5dm8[/ame]

 

It is an interpretation and not the whole story. Like i said, this thread and this time are not really appropriate for anyone wanting to besmirch his name or bring up unsavoury incidents from his 74 years as a human being.

All i will say is that it is probably just as well he was nasty to Frazier and Liston, because who knows what kind of status he would have, if he had not shown a flaw in his character.

 

To criticise one of the best sportsman the day after he died is just tasteless. 20th century icon died.

 

Daibhi you could have waited a day but I don't like the way you are saying his whole character was flawed. His refusal to fight in Vietnam was a supreme act of courage coming from a black man who had a fantastic career as a top boxer laid out before him.

 

When you deem the time to be right you be sure to come back to me with your "interpretation" then, okay?