Liel Abada

This thread is absolutely * hoaching. It’s outed a few. Not the only one either.

As for Abada. I hope he remains with us. His statement the other day was absolutely fine. Whether it was actually his own words is perhaps up for debate, but we can only take it at face value unless he says anything otherwise.

Bitton on the other hand. I made my feeling clear on him the other day, and I stand by them.

 

You're * mental

 

I'm afraid none of that is really comparable Sean.

None of those countries have mandatory military service, and none of them are apartheid states.

In addition, it's highly unlikely that the population of any of those countries would demand the players resign from the club in the same situation. There are myriad political landscapes and socio economic viewpoints within those societies, with sizable anti war movements and organisations.

Also, I don't believe any of these players you mention are deeply religious, to the point that Abada is, and as we know, Religion and politics go hand in hand and inform and dictate eachother.
I also don't think any of those players have served in their countries military, a military I might add that has committed and is committing various war crimes.

If you'd like a better understanding of Israeli society, and the indoctrination of the "victim" status that occurs from early ages, as well as an insight into the roles played by American Jews and Mossad in perpetrating a siege mentality and the "expectation" of a 2nd Jewish Holocaust...

I suggest you watch the documentary "Defamation", by Israeli filmmaker Yoav Shamir, who has since become persona non grata in his own country.

 

Sorry to go off topic but is the wee man still injured?

 

I just found the entire documentary on Youtube and watched it in bits. I didnt realise how much Israel pushed this ideaology of ant-semitism to it's citizens. Basically telling them that every other country in the world is anti-semitic and that another holocaust is very possible or even imminent. Raising children to live in fear. To hate everyone and everything that isnt Jewish. Picking out every single little comment made by anyone of importance throughout the world and using to push this propaganda on its citizens. Dangerous stuff.

To rule by fear is not uncommon....every government does this. Its the same even in this country....there is always some kind of crisis.....always something to be afraid of. It keeps the people worried, scared and not entirely focused on what the government is doing behind the scenes. Here for the past maybe 20 odd years.....its been the Taliban, Al Qaeda, Sadam Hussain, Osama Bin Laden, then straight onto Isis where we were all gonna be beheaded for being non-Muslims, then they disappeared off the face of the earth....just vanished...... then it was Covid..... then the war in Ukraine......now the war in Palestine. Its always something. It seems like these things are carefully choreographed to begin just as the previous one is fading out of the news. And Britain is always the good guys, liberating countries and defending the freedom of the world of course.

Propaganda is powerful and very effective. They dont even care if you know the truth anymore. They used to care. Now they dont. Cause they know that even if you know you are being lied to.....what can you actually do about it??? Absolutely nothing. You are powerless to change what is going on and the government know this.

 

I was being facetious mate.

I'll check out that documentary after work.

 

You are aware Israel has compulsory military conscription, he would have had no choice but to serve.
People need to stop judging the guy on where he is from and his religion.

 

That was the bit that shook me.

Yep old Polish gentleman merely starting a friendly conversation with the kids, Mossad agent rushes over, pulls them away "they just called you dirty Jews". I was * flabbergasted. Even when the director told the kids later " he didn't say that, they said nothing like that", the kids kept on the defensive about how the world hated them.

It was horrific to watch those poor kids be poked, prodded, manipulated by those Mossad agents on that trip, brainwashing in action.

 

Of course I'm aware. It's the exact same reason that Wonder Woman has come in for so much criticism, in America of all places.

Compulsory military service is as much to do with indoctrination as it does defence.

You spend years in any military, especially one on a conflict zone, your attitudes and perspectives are going to be informed by what you witnessed and experienced.

I don't understand the point you're trying to make.

I haven't judged Abada in the slightest. I've merely presented a counterpoint to the argument that CCV, Hart etc are in the same boat because of the actions of their governments.

Abada would've been FULLY aware of the support for the Palestinian people within our support. FULLY aware of it.

He made a career choice to join us, always plays his heart out, and is yet to go spit the dummy and go "political".

 

Yup. He’s a total hot air merchant. He rattles on like some deranged side-character from a Martin McDonagh play - as though the rest of us have no Irish heritage/identity/insights at all - to justify his own hateful, neanderthal (and therefore ironically Hun-like) views. ‘I’m more provo than you’. Aye v good. Total wee-guy patter.

 

Lol I've lived in Israel. When the hardliners get on you case, there's no turning back or reasoning with them, they even target family members, I don't think you quite understand the politics and mentality of the hardline Israelis..politically in Israel it'll be a no no and once we do Palestinians flag day it'll be an even bigger no no..but we'll wait and see then

 

This was me as well. I even debated at one time signing up for the 'cause' in my yoof, i was so enraged by the Brits...but then the peace process came along and that, plus growing up, mellowed me out..a LOT lol

 

That's an excellent point about compulsory military service which I never actually considered.

 

Hahaha!

Same here. I got asked the "question", was told if I was "serious" then there's no going back. One you're in it, you're in it.

I thankfully had a head on my shoulders and wanted to see the world. Not spend all my life in West Belfast with guns under the shed waiting for the Brits to kick my door in.

But different times. I was doing my a levels, peace process was on the road, and things were getting considerably better for Catholics.

But the older generation, they never really had a choice. It was just the done thing. Kids would join the Provies or stickies just because their friends did, or because your parents were connected.

You reach an age, you joined up. Bussed out to the countryside for training, then boom, that's it. You're in. Never really out.

That's why I'm sympathetic towards young Israelis. They literally have zero choice in the matter.
Their government is another thing altogether. But there's no real judgement on my side for Abada, or for Biton.
Biton let his emotions and newly found "zeal" get the better of him. But it's not really his fault.

 

I knew a few people older than me that weren't fans of the Brits shall we say lol...anyhoo by 1994, it was quite settled so my anger / pure rage / intense effing hatred of all things Brits...had subsided a lot. (I still refuse to hold a British passport even though I was born here though lol) Anyhoo...I have no issues with Bitton or Abada either and I totally get it myself, maybe we need to tap into the Egyptian market in the future hehe

Edit
I met a lot of young Israelis in Tel Aviv 92/93 and we had some interesting talks over the IRA fighting for freedom and the Palestinians fighting for freedom. The majority were pro Israel but some could also see other angles.

 

You see the thing Liel needs to understand in this situation that ordinary people no matter where you go outwith Israel are, on the majority at least, pro Palestinian. Just look at London and New York. There were massive rallies there in support of Palestine. The governments may show support to Israel but the ordinary working man is very much pro palestine.

My point is, no matter what club he plays for, outside of Israel, you're bound to be running into a Palestinian flag or two in the stands.

 

I think yes you are right people understand the cause of a people and support it. But in terms of football I think GB tend to make it quite explicit in their displays though, that's where the difference is. It's not the same as couple of Scottish or Japanese flags held by a few fans it's a display/tifo with a message. Can't recall another club in the UK or Europe that does it or rather, is known to do it.

 

A lot of jewish citizens dont do their military service and are jailed.for it. Gid bless every last one of them

 

Aye. It used to be quite a few years in jail when I was there, although I think it's not so bad now. I also recall a conversation where the person told me your life is also finished once you come out of jail as most people hate you and will refuse to employ you for not serving. The pressure to serve in Israel is immense so kudos to those who won't.

The Israeli High Court of Justice ruled in 2002 that refusal to serve was legal on the grounds of unqualified pacifism, but "selective refusal" which accepted some duties and not others was illegal. The court said that allowing selective refusal would "weaken the ties that bind us as a nation". The court also said that the refusal to serve in the territories is selective refusal and not conscientious objection.