Celtic Supporters Thread (contains GB chat)

I do think there has been a complete failure on their part to take responsibility for that banner and unless and until they can explain why, I can only personally interpret the refusal to clarify it as a bit cowardly TBH. I still don't think they support HAMAS, though. Even in secret.

 

Standard Israeli government tactic: conflate anti-semitism anti-zionism. Particularly irresponsible as there is really a frightening amount of genuine antisemitism around right now, as others have pointed out.

 

I completely agree with fighting anti-semitism. However to suggest Celtic fans as a wider group have been guilty of that is nonsense.

 

https://www.aljazeera.com/sports/20...-brigade-palestine-support-israel-war-on-gaza

 

That's hilarious

 

I'd say they'd support the right for Hamas to defend palastine in all means necessary yet not agree with what they did. I know it's abit contradictory but at the same time it's not. We don't live in there culture and see the daily struggling they all go through so really who are we to judge. Yes it's wrong to kill the innocent but that's us living on the western world were we go about our daily lives living in a free society. You watch your family get tortured, slaughtered. Men, women and children blown to pieces. I'll guarantee you your mindset will change. We see it often on here with comments about rapists, peados that we'd all kill them if they harmed our loves ones. Well amplify that ten fold and watch your children come home in pieces and you'll want revenge. This is the mindset of anyone on Hamas now and for that, it's difficult for some to condemn them. Even the IRA openly killed innocent protestants at the start of the trouble and yet we all supportered them.

 

I don't envy Abada at all, and would completely understand if he wants to leave us because it's too difficult a situation for him personally.

Anyone who thinks he has that sort of sway in the club is delusional. Sounds like complete and utter nonsense in all honesty.

What does the painter say?

 

It was hardly an attack RR! more a, very justified, pointing out of the reality of what was actually said.

We can totally agree on cowardly anyway.

 

Best for Abada to get a fresh start elsewhere I think, if it's possible.

 

Possibly, but hopefully it's his decision not others.

I'd have no problem with him staying.

In fact he'd possibly go to my number one admired player, as don't think even think The King had it this tough when he went through his leg break. This is next level in terms of a player having to deal with playing for Celtic.

 

I'm sorry, mate, but I can't disagree more. You make several powerful arguments for why Palestinians who support HAMAS are not morons; but I'm not aware of anyone saying they are. Certainly, I haven't anyway. I have no right to judge them even where I disagree. I don't even feel I have any right to judge the young men who join this organisation to fight for them.

Not a single one of those arguments applies to the GB, though. HAMAS are not some Palastinian version of the IRA; they are even worse than the IDF in my honest opinion.

Yes, I really mean that. I think they are worse than the IDF, because at least the IDF care about the lives of their own civilians and try to protect them. For HAMAS, defending Palestinians is very much subordinate to destroying Israel. The IDF and HAMAS are about equally evil in how little value they place on the lives of non-combatants on the opposite side and both are commiting horrific war crimes as we speak. Where HAMAS are genuinely more evil than the IDF and what sickens me even more than the recent terror attack is that HAMAS place very little value on the lives of civilians on "their own" side (note the scare quotes which are very much intended). That's not me making a big deal out of a technicality, it's honestly something I find deeply, deeply repulsive and disturbing about this kind of group.

They wanted this response and went all out to make it happen and they deliberately operate out of civilian infrastructure like hospitals so they can have one of their photo ops every time there's a civilian mass casualty event. None of this makes any sense if your goal is to defend Palestinians and bring the questions of justice for Palestinians and a free Palestinian state back onto the international agenda (there are legitimate military targets that would do that just as well); but it makes perfect sense if your long-term goal is to destroy Israel at whatever cost in human lives.

If the GB really do support "The right for Hamas to defend Palestine by all means necessary" (which hasn't been shown), then I hope they are banned sine die.

 

Fair enough, mate. I've made my strong personal feelings about HAMAS clear in a post just above this one. I hate them, mate. My gut feeling that I can't shake is that they are a necrophilliac organisation in Erich Fromm's sense of the word (I'm not a psychologist and I'm not qualified to make that kind of diagnosis; it's just my personal opinion). If you read that (even if you don't share my opinion), I think you'll understand better why I don't want to believe the GB support what HAMAS are doing unless I see very clear evidence.

 

For what it's worth, I don't agree with the innocent killings that hammas have done but as my post says, who am I to judge them. I don't live there but I know one thing, when you see killings all around you against your own family and community it does change your perspective. It's easy for us to point the finger when we don't live there. Israel like the Brits created the circumstances in which hammas and the IRA rose from. I can understand why they just went on a rampage. As mentioned on my previous posts, I grew up in the heart of oppression and while it wasn't on the scale of what's happening in Gaza, it was still * horrific and it does shape ones mind into hating the other side and wanting revenge. I watched the killings of my community from a very young age and when our side took revenge, we couldn't give a flying * if they where innocent. We seen it as they stood by and supported the enemy so it was water of a ducks back when we heard and seen the other side murdered.

Something not to be proud off but it is what it is and its what shaped our young minds growing up with mayhem all around us. And if you want abit of perspective on it, go take a history lesson or watch documentries on the troubles about how we lived. It was * brutal!

This is what anyone in hammas is thinking now. What we see is innocent Jews, they see them they aren't innocent if they are occupying their stolen land, voting them scummy * into power who continue to slaughter them. So really can you blame them for wanting revenge! Do you honestly think them young men running about with them guns actually want to be there. No chance! They have been giving a choice about living in an open prison or fight against it and they have choosen to fight in what way they see fit just like anyone who fought against the Brits in the north. Most of the Provo's all said, they wanted a normal life to work and grow old with there family but it was the Brits that created the conditions and they had no choice but to take up arms and fight whatever way necessary just as hammas are.

And again, I'm older and wiser now and have a changed mindset from which I had growing up in Ardoyne during the troubles. I have done many things against the other side that now I know is wrong and TBH, should have spent alot of time inside for. Now I don't agree with killing innocent people and in no way do I agree with what hammas have done, but what I can say is i totally understand it. I will never judge a man who has no other option to take up arms and fight whst he thinks is right wether I agree with him or not! It is * * they are living in. Yous need to remember that!

 

Supporting Palestine isn’t Anti-Semetic.

Very dangerous thing to suggest.

 

Thank you for sharing your personal experience. I appreciate that. I agreed and agree that I have no right to judge Palrestinians who support HAMAS and I even added above that I don't think I can judge the young men who choose to fight for them for exactly the kind of reasons you bring up. We don't disagree on any of that. There are also edge cases that are hard to judge: are heavily armed settlers in the West Bank civilians or legitimate military targets? I honestly don't know (at least regarding the adults). However, everything I've read on all sides suggests that the people at that concert and in that Kibbutz were absolutely innocent civilians and that this choice of target was not a coincidence.

I can and do express my opinion on HAMAS as an organisation and its leaders and for any non-Palestinian who supports them. It's exactly what I said above. HAMAS are not on the side of the Palestinians except in the abstract. They're on the side of destruction. It's what separates them from other organisations that I might have more nuanced views about.

 

Thing is, it's not even being suggested now, it's now normalised as the "truth".

I was obviously younger but what's happening now does bring echos of the debate on South Africa and whether Apartheid was wrong.

It's been hard in recent years to believe that governments and societies backed Apartheid in South Africa and questioned anyone who thought it was wrong that a White person in South Africa should be worth more than a Black person.

Thought we were past this *, but obviously not.

Honestly horrified by what is now seen as ok and green lit by our country.

For all the GB may not be perfect they are so much better than the originalGB, who are scum to the core. Brits got to Brit though.

 

The board have done a pretty good job of obfuscating the reason for the ban.

The GB have tried quite a few people's patience and they're focusing on that, rather than the real reason, which is that they'll hand out Palestine flags, wave political banners, and lead protest chants between now and the time that Israel have decided they've had enough target practice.

It's all about the club's image and sponsorship. The bottom line is the bottom line. And anyone that thinks the tifos bring in more revenue than corporate sponsorship is off their rocker.

 

I never said they were guilty “as a wider group” - perhaps you should actually read my point before formulating your reply.

I said SOME of our fans are drifting in that direction. And I wholeheartedly stand by that opinion, because I’ve witnessed this behaviour first hand. As have others I’ve talked with. It’s certainly a minority, but that doesn’t make me feel any better about it. It’s a worrying and dangerous development no matter how small in total numbers.

I think you would have to be pretty naive to think the GB could push all this nonsense into our support, and none of our fans would take things too far and start spewing hatred.

It’s beyond naivety actually, it’s more like wilful ignorance from some people.

I’ve seen the dangers of this stuff from the outset. In addition to the fact that it does nothing of substance to actually help the situation in the ME, it’s just an opportunity for certain factions within our support to sniff their own farts and cultivate some sort of holier than thou *-like complex where they seem to think they’re untouchable.

These guys are nothing more than a poor man’s tribute band to other club’s ultra sections. A lazy copycat act. They’re not original and they’re certainly not untouchable… if they think they can take on the rest of the club and the board and bully everyone, they’ll lose!

 

what behaviour have you witnessed first hand, you obviously havent a * clue what you are talking about if you think its just the green brigade opposed to the ongoing torture and slaughter of the people of palestine ,something you have casually described as nonsense . i dont know what sort of idiotic narative you are trying to spew but its totally out of step with any celtic fan ive ever met go on tell us all about the dangers of this stuff for a laugh

 

You’re * clueless. Please stop posting on here.

As for seeing things first hand, you’ve never been to Celtic Park in yer puff.