Poppygate? No, simply the Old Divide & Conquer routine... (long post)

A fantastic article from eTims, and if you ask me, the definitive commentary over the recent events...

Poppygate? Nope, Simply The Old Divide & Conquer Routine
Written by Che Timvara
ETims Online Celtic Fanzine - Poppygate? Nope, Simply The Old Divide & Conquer Routine

Growing up in our media age, which breeds cynicism and contempt in equal measure, it’s hard to escape the notion that we see only what the assorted media show us. Very rarely do we probe past cosmetics, and go to the heart of things, to the truth.

A prevailing point is in how we are forced to interpret debate as division, at how controversy can sometimes be conjured out of nothing with the twin objectives of increasing our consumption of the media and fulfilling agendas either personal or political.

In this, we tend to forget that division and debate are not one and the same thing. One is destructive, the other constructive. One can have positive effects. The other tends to have negative ones.
Recently, there have been a number of reports in the press, seeking to put our club’s fans in a bad light. The agenda, on the surface, appears to be an effort to smear our supporters in order to divert attention from the despicable behaviour of large numbers of Scotland's Shame fans, and to some degree this has been moderately successful.

Those who see recent events as mere attacks on our fans from outside the club have missed the point, though.

Something deeper is going on here, and allow me to tell you what I think it is. It is an effort to split the Celtic support, and the motive behind it is the further advancement of the cause of anti-Irish racism in Scotland. Think that sounds crazy? Bear with me for a moment and I’ll tell you why I think so.

There are two issues here; the songs debate and the poppy debate.

First, let me say that these are debates, and not divisions, and they are perfectly healthy debates at that. On the first, the notion of Republican singing, and what is and is not acceptable in a modern society, is a controversial subject, and one where debate was needed if that question was ever going to be answered. The club’s comments of late have come close to clarifying the matter once and for all; these songs are neither racist nor bigoted, but as they often offend not only the wider community but sections of our own support the club would rather they were not sung.

Neither racist nor bigoted, the club has said. There, in crystal clear language, is Celtic’s position, and no right-minded person could ever have thought otherwise. That aside, this needed to be said, and now our club has done so, we can move forward, secure in the knowledge that we have a weapon with which to hit back at the people who claim the section of our support singing these songs is sectarian.

Celtic’s stance on the matter has borne out the views of the fans who wanted the position clarified. Those who say these songs are bigoted are as ignorant of the history which underpins them as they are of the present political climate. The Irish conflict is over, and at a time when not only the British government but most of the Unionist parties of the North of Ireland recognise the legitimacy of Sinn Fein the claim that the situation in the Six Counties was not a war situation, and those involved in it were not combatants, is nonsensical.

Those who call the heroes of Irish history terrorists are ignoring a basic and fundamental truth; these people were pursuing a political agenda, and they and their contemporaries are now recognised as key players in that process. Thereby, as distasteful as it might be for some to accept it, the songs Celtic fans sing about the Armed Struggle are songs of a political and not sectarian nature, which makes them a legitimate form of expression.

Equally clear is the second part of Celtic’s statement that they want to see those songs vanish from the stands. There is a time and a place for them, and that is not at the football, so says the logic of the argument, and if even some of our own fans are offended by them, as is clearly the case, what good do they serve?

And so, the debate goes on. The songs continue to be sung, by a number of fans. Their argument is also clear; in a free society, there is no inalienable right not to be offended, and provided a line into illegal activity is not crossed no-one has a right to restrict another’s freedom of expression. This argument is no more or less valid than the one put forward by Celtic, and so yes, there is a debate, and it is one which will probably be going on for a long time to come.

But let me state again the central point of this case; debate does not equate division, although some would like it just fine if it did, and in that lies the first clear indicator as to what is really going on here, and it has been made clearer still by the poppy debate.

The debate about poppies did not come out of nowhere, as much as it might seem to be the case. It appears to many as though it was an issue forced upon us, and I have sympathy with that view. The way in which it was appropriated, not by any “radical group” of Celtic fans, but by sections of the press, and by Scotland's Shame Football Club and others, points me towards that stance.

Let me first address those who have said the club mishandled this whole issue. I firmly disagree with that view. I believe the action taken by our club was the only action open to us. Think, for just one second, about what the response from the media would have been had we did what many have advocated since; imagine we had either refused the SPL request to wear the poppies on our shirts or offered the fans their say on the matter beforehand?

The club knows full well that in the first instance it would have been a public relations disaster which would have wiped out, completely, all the negative coverage being directed at Scotland's Shame fans and The Famine Song in weeks past and put us firmly in the spotlight as the backward and socially out-of-touch club. Whether Celtic will publicly admit it or not, John Reid’s statement on The Famine Song was a clear signal that times have changed and we are no longer going to tolerate finger-pointing from hypocrites or being the targets of abuse. As he said at the AGM recently, we are a distinctly different club to Rangers, not simply a different side of the same coin, and the unspoken subtext of that is simple; If Scotland's Shame themselves are not prepared to tackle the sectarian element of their support, for the good of the game and for the good of our society, Reid and Celtic are going to force that action upon them, whatever it takes.

To have fought a no-win battle over the poppies would have dealt a blow to Celtic’s ongoing strategy vis-à-vis Scotland's Shame and the section of their support which refuses to change, because it would have created a negative perception of our club amongst the population as a whole, at a time when we need the full force of moral and public opinion on our side. Let’s not forget that whatever our views on John Reid on an individual level, our club chairman is a world class political operator, who knows all the tricks. Reid knew full well not to open our club up to attacks at a time when we were making considerable headway on an issue of tremendous social significance.

It would have had another effect too, the same effect as the second option; it might have caused a serious split amongst our supporters.

Undeniably, there has been a split, on this one issue, but the way the club handled it assured that it was a small one. And whilst the debate has been fierce, it was largely had outside public eye. Neither the club nor the support as a whole has been damaged by that.

In the end, the club’s decision to hold a minute’s applause was fully vindicated, as the event went off without a hitch. The great response of the vast majority of the fans was heartfelt and dignified; those who wanted to maintain silence, either out of respect for the war dead, or in silent protest at certain aspects of the situation, did so for the most part. Those who wanted to show their appreciation of the sacrifice of those who went to war, or who did so in celebration of the freedom which allows celebration as well as protest, did so.

In true Celtic fans style, it brought credit to everyone involved.

Ten minutes into the match, a section of fans left, to go outside and protest not only the situation regarding the forced wearing of the poppies by our players, but the perceived role of our Chairman in a situation which has cost the lives of uncounted victims of a recent conflict, the one in Iraq.

The crucial factor here is they did it outside, where they did not disturb fellow fans or distract from the game. This, too, whether one agrees with their protest or not, was done with class, with dignity and with respect for their fellow supporters. To claim, as some have, that they embarrassed the club is to miss the woods for the trees; what they did was perfectly in line with what this club is and has always been about; diversity, inclusion, tolerance and respect for all. Agree or disagree with their politics, as is your right, but they showed their class, Celtic class, in how they made their point.

Some have tried to put a different slant on it.

Internal debates have been portrayed as unbridgeable divisions, and groups of fans have been played against one another. At the heart of all of this is one thing; Celtic’s Irish roots.

The Famine Song is but one in a long line of chants designed to put the Irish in Scotland on the defensive. Whether Celtic is an Irish club or a Scottish club or, as I believe, a hybrid of both is irrelevant when one considers this point; for a large number of Irish-Scots, it is the one institution in this nation they most clearly identify with as their own. Celtic is where many feel at home.

Anti-Irish sentiment in Scotland has rarely been more keenly felt or on such naked display as in the present time. The media has tried to ignore it when it has not been disgustingly helping to perpetuate it, as with the treatment routinely dished out to Lennon, McGeady and now young James McCarthy. Yet for all the efforts of certain sections of the media, and large sections of Scottish society as a whole, the strategy of trying to undermine the place of the Irish in our communities has been largely a failure; this is in no small part down to the response of the non-Irish supporters of our club, who like the defeated fighters of the slaves rebellion against Rome stood and said “I am Spartacus”, and stood alongside their Irish brothers and sisters in condemning the treatment being meted out to them.

The solidarity the non-Irish Celtic fans showed to their brothers and sisters amongst that community is one of the greatest gestures in the history of our support, and it has strengthened the ethos of Family that runs through us now and has made us the undisputed Best Fans in the World. It is precisely this spirit of solidarity that recent events has been designed to undermine; in short, what the racist, bigoted element of Scottish culture has failed to do on its own, it now seeks to have sections of our own supporter do on its their behalf.

It wants to turn our fans against one another, until the Irish element is forced out. It wants to use us as a further stick with which to beat the collective Irish community, for if Irishness and expressions of the same are not tolerated at Celtic Park, where, then, will the Irish in Scotland feel truly secure? Using the songs debate as wedge, they made very little ground. The poppy debate took them a step closer than before. They are still a long way from any degree of what they would call success, but they will not simply give up and go away. Doubtless they have other cards to play, and as time goes by we will see what they are, and hopefully we will deal with them the way we have dealt with the present situation.

Debate is good. It’s not the same as division. In the end, when the chips are down, we are all on the same side. This, above all, is what we have to remember.

In the last few days, two leading Scotland's Shame fans groups have issued statements in response to George Galloway’s question in the House of Commons on The Famine Song. Mark Dingwall and Steven Smith have, again, called the song “banter”, told us to develop a sense of humour (and to “get used to it”, as disgusting as that idea is) and have denied that the song is either sectarian or racist.

One can only wonder when a more sensible group of Scotland's Shame fans will step forward to publicly debate these morons, who are not only an embarrassment to their own club but to Scottish society as a whole. As if flying in the face of such widespread condemnation was not bad enough, they magnify that disgrace every time they try to defend the indefensible. At a moment like this, it is plain for all to see that they truly are Scotland’s Shame.

Always remember, they can’t win unless we let them divide us into different camps. We are Celtic. We are one. We are not, and will never be, like them.

Hail Hail.

 

couldn't agree more, its time some of the media in this country faced up to their own hypocrisy and ditched their inflammatory, sensationalist reporting

 

I agree with that, said that all along.

Got a bit cheesy towards the end though.

 

Brilliant article.

 

That was a great read... with a very solid opinion from the center of the issue that covers the entire picture succinctly.
I have to say, as a foreigner, I thought it was rather odd that all players (many not involved with Britain in any sort of context) had to wear a poppy. Did Hinkel play that day? What did Hearts players think about it? I would have to think that at least a little awkward and a pointless politicization of a sporting event.

 

yet again some-one saying celtic say this celtic say that.who at celtic said it

 

Ever heard of the Celtic spokesperson?

 

Where is this statement? If Celtic have made an official statement saying that all Republican songs are neither racist or bigoted I must have missed it.

I don't agree with that at all. Yes I stood and applauded, but it made my flesh crawl. It certainly did not bring 'credit'.

 

hahaha, it wouldnt let me read the article, it said having a SEBO, pure brilliant

 

It wasn't phrased as he says, but the meaning seems pretty obvious to me Reid has made the point that IRA songs are not racist or sectarian.


"We have to be careful, from our own point of view and that’s why I am absolutely delighted that our fans in recent years have had accolades from the world football authorities, from the European football authorities and let me say when I point out that there may be a minority who are transgressing our own rules, that they are our own rules. I don’t know any Celtic fans who have been chanting racist slogans or anything of that nature, so I am not comparing like with like here. (((the context for this non-comparison is of course the famine song)))But I am saying that we have got to be whiter than white and that we have to explain to and educate everybody at this club, including that tiny minority which at away games sometimes leaves us exposed to those who would attempt to say that we are all the same. We aren’t all the same, but we have to make sure that that is evident to everybody. That’s the nature of Celtic Football Club."
Celtic AGM: Chairman's interview

 

Couldnt agree with him more.

I don't care if the issue was marmite on your toast, if it gives us bad press, then stop, simple easy.

 

Pretty intresting read good article.

 

So as I am a complete neutral to all this and haven't been home in over a year, are you saying that this stuff isn't happening, or just that it is not substantiated. I find it kind of hard to believe that people are behaving well and then getting kicked out, it seems far fetched.

 

In true politician style, that reply from Reid could be interpreted in many different ways. I certainly don't take from it the same as the author of the original post that 'No Republican songs are racist or bigoted'.

In many interviews I've heard from Peter Lawwell, he has praised the support at CP while admitting that songs sung at away games are a 'problem'. Neither he or John Reid are likely to openly attack their own supporters are they?

 

Well let's break down the things he does say...

1. Not "racist or of that nature"
2. We have to be "whiter than white"
3. We "are not comparing like with like"

From one and three it's easy to make the point that these problematic songs are not bigoted. If you care to argue that, I'd consider you playing semantics.
From two and three it's easy to make the point that Reid considers these songs to be a lesser degree of fault than what Rangers do.

His overall point is that Celtic intends to maintain the moral ground by raising the bar. And I very much agree with him there.

 

He says he doesn't know of any Celtic fan who chants racist slogans......I would go along with that, although I have heard racist remarks from supporters in the not too distant past. He does not however say that he does not know of any Celtic fan who chants bigoted slogans. And the reason he does not say that is because he knows, as I know that we do have bigots amongst us. To deny it is to live in a fantasy world. I don't consider that semantics, I consider that a fact based on my own experiences.

I completely agree that we do have to be whiter than white if we want to take part in any debate about what our own or other clubs fans sing.

I also agree with Hammer in that the only people who seem to want to drag this issue out are the Green Brigade themselves. They are a fringe group who do not represent the views of the majority of the Celtic support (as the size of their protest demonstrated) and if I was being cynical (which I am) then I would think that they were enjoying their 15 minutes of fame playing the oppressed minority.

 

I don't know much about the Green Brigade, but they do have a very proffesional looking website.

However they have said something I am interested in.
the Green Brigade are fanatical Celtic supporters and will not try to be cheerleaders for the crowd
So where do we get cheerleaders then, because that is something I am interested in!

 

Peter Lawwell has stated for some time that Celtic fans do NOT sing sectarian songs. On Setenta Sports Press Box show last year, after a game at Pittodrie were Celtic fans were accused of sectarian singing, Lawwell defended the fans by saying "Our support does not sing sectarian songs, they sing political songs. We have asked them to desist from doing this as a sporting ground is no place to be airing political views. But the accusation that our fans sing sectarian songs is simply not true".