Rugby League World Cup 2013

If I may, I’ve got a couple of things for the league fans. I’m a union man BTW (ex-player, referee & now kids coach. Been involved for over 30 years). Now the dust has settled do you think that the world cup was successful and will it provide some kind of legacy for future generations? There was plenty of enthusiasm and lots of packed crowds but will it go beyond that? Do you see more recruits outside of the RL heartlands as a result of the WC?

The way I see it, in the northern hemisphere anyway, is that it’s a niche sport – coveted by those from Lancs & Yorks – hardly anywhere else. Sure, you could highlight the various clubs from all over the country - but be honest with yourselves – it didn’t really take off and reading about the Bronco’s woes I think it’s going to get worse. I’ve been to a couple of matches (Hull) and the family atmosphere was superb and I’ve spoken to fans and they’re passionate about the sport.

We have a reverse situation now, since union become pro. Some of the best players are going where the money is and playing union (Farrell, Ashton etc.) and the working class lads from the valleys are sticking with union where previously they would have moved to league to earn a living in the sport.
Does the world really need two codes? Would rugby (as a whole - <shudder>) have a better chance if they joined back together again?

I desperately wanted to like RL and had the telly on during the WC but it left me flat and I lost interest. A poster mentioned above about it being faster, is it? There are times when it’s lightning fast but most times during their sets the ball carrier takes the ball into contact where he is stopped by three big burly men who take about 20 seconds to slowly drag him to the ground while the referee makes farmyard impersonations (mooo :icon_mrgreen. Then they do it another 4 or 5 times before the inevitable kick into the corner. Dull, dull, dull, dull – dull.

I spend about 4 hours every Sunday morning teaching kids how to ruck, maul and scrum. It’s proper teamwork, it’s tactical. We’ve even picked up lots of good things from RL – running angles, offloads, dummy runners and deep passes.

So apologies for the dissertation but I’ve been thinking about if a lot. I see RL dying and I don’t take any pleasure from it. Thoughts please?

 

I'm a Union man too, but I do enjoy a game of league as well.
I think both codes have their merits and I do find it odd when fans of one code -and it does seem to me to be mostly League fans guilty of this- refuse to acknowledge anything good about the other code. Surely if anyone likes a game of rugby they can get enjoyment from both games?

I had never seen a League game 'live' until this World Cup. I went to the opener in Cardiff and the final last weekend in Manchester.
The atmosphere was poor in both games, the opening game should have been in the northern heartlands, somewhere like Elland Road, and the final desperately needed either England to be in it, or for New Zealand to put up a fight, the fact that Australia were streets ahead so early on killed the game, with all the neutrals seemingly behind New Zealand, a world record crowd was quiet as a Hun on Mastermind.

TV coverage of the tournament seemed poor, I'm sure there probably was stuff on at weekends on terrestrial TV (I'm always out watching live sport on a weekend) but there was nothing that I saw during the week while group games were going on. I would guess if you asked the man in the street anywhere south of Nottingham what they thought of the tournament the vast majority wouldn't even have known it was taking place.

There were some good crowds, including 7,000 here in Bristol for USA v Cook Islands, but I still can't help feeling that an opportunity was lost to promote the game throughout the UK.

 

The opener was in the Millennium Stadium between England and Australia and the atmosphere was poor? Christ, that takes some doing - that place has an atmosphere of it's own - even when empty.

Agree with your point regarding RL fans attitudes, it can be almost like a bit of reverse snobbery. Also, I don't think football pitches lend themselves to playing rugby - they're too small, even Old Trafford. Did you see the way that Aussie creamed in to the hoardings after he scored?

 

To be fair, the atmosphere in the pubs before the game was great, the problem was when 40,000 people in an 80,000 capacity stadium had to compete with seemingly the loudest PA system in the world, with a stadium matchday announcer who brought new meaning to the phrase 'over-hyped'.
Come the revolution, annoying matchday announcers should be first against the wall.

 

I was there and that was boring. In terms of on the pitch excitement, that was the worst Challenge Cup final i'd been to and I was watching my own team winning it. Don't get me wrong i'm not a hardcore Wigan fan or anything, i'm sure those that are enjoyed it immensely but the atmosphere and everything else was much flatter than a normal Challenge Cup final once it became obvious Wigan were gonna stroll it.

 

Just read through todays posts and I would agree with alot of the points raised. I don't think the World Cup was a great success, I am not sure how much point there is trying to raise the profile of Rugby League outside of the Yorkshire/Lancashire areas I would even concede there is perhaps some inverted snobbery about union. However from a personal point of view I do think it is faster and a few people at work who are not Rugby League fans said the same to me after the England v New Zealand game. I personally have no interest in watching a game of Union as I find it a boring game. As I have said I agree with alot of the points about the atmosphere at the games etc but tbh I think that is irrelavant when discussing the merits of the games and can be put down the fact Rugby League is far more centralised around Yorks/Lancs in this country. I am not really sure how morphing the games together would work.

 

I thought i would chip in to this debate , Rugby league has been a passion of mine for a while now and im currently coaching a club side and involved at county level .
The pure Union v League debate has been raging for a number of years , my view point on the matter is plain and simple League has always been the better game some may say thats because im involved in the game however if you look deeper you will see why i say this , Back in the early 90s the debate was raging as much as we try to debate there is always a How do we prove who is best ?.
During the mid 90s Wigan and Bath set up 2 cross code games one league game played at Maine Rd the Union game at England HQ Twickenham , The first game was a totally one sided clash with wigan outclassing their Union opponents 82 points to 6 .
wigan returned to Twickenham for the Union end of season extravaganza that is the middlesex 7s and duly went on to trounce everything in front of them and beating Wasps in the final 38-15 .

Wigan then travelled back to Twickenham and the Union Lads were looking for a similair score to the League game in Manchester citing Wigan wouldnt be able to handle the pressure of Rucks, Mauls, Lineouts & Scrums ... bath didnt ahve it their own way at all and flattered themselves with a 44-19 scoreline .
This certainly made Union sit up and notice what was happening , League wasnt all professional but it seemed they trained and played at 100% all the time and it wasnt long before the big money started flying around and it was no surprise when Phil Larder moved to union , one of the most respected coaches he worked with Bath then Leicester Tigers before becoming defensive Coach in the English Union set up .
This seemed to start the floodgates with the likes of Larder , Joe Lydon , Shaun Edwards , Ellery Hanley, Andy Farrell & Mike Ford all at one point coaching Union ..
For me this is when Union got better and it is no coincedence they did it with experienced league coaches in charge ...make of that what you will .

 

Thats the Problem with the sport in general ..I know wigan trained harder than ever this year and the ethos was to win as many games as possible conceding as little points as possible ..
Its very easy to be 18-0 up with 2 mins to go defending your line and to let the opposition in to score a consolation try but Wigan went the extra mile and didnt want to concede that day .
Yes to many spectators it was boring but the way wigan controlled the ruck and won the floor was a delight for the purist .
Every team trains hard to get the rewards , wigan this year probably trained harder than most .
There was a time earlier this year i went to help out the Under 16s being put through their paces and Pat Richards was still there on his own with a bag of ball practicing his kicking an hour after the 1st team had finished training , that says it all to me ...

 

I appreciate your reply and also to StPauli1916.

Interesting that you highlight the cross code matches in the early 90s - I remember it well as lived in Bath at the time and was a regular down the Rec. You're aware that Union was an * game at the time while League was Pro (so a bit like Celtic playing Forres Mechanics :icon_mrgreen

I'm also as passionate about union as you are about league - so that doesn't matter.

What I'm really trying to get at is - do you think the world cup has had a lasting effect? Will anything positive come from it - the final was only a week and a half ago and it's already 'yesterdays news'. When the union world cup took place a couple of years back the uptake in participation was quite significant - for example http://www.rugbyworldcup.com/home/news/newsid=2063499.html

I get your point about the skills that league players and coaches have brought to union (as I mentioned in my first post about dummy runners, deep passes etc.) and I remember Alan Tait going to Widnes (I think) when he came back to union he was fantastic - a big strong runner who held the tackle well and timed the offload to perfection.

Do you think that league will go beyond Yorks & Lancs? RL needs international matches and it seems that only 3 countries do that (England, Aus & NZ). In spite of my admiration of some of the skill sets, I'm struggling to see the point.

I'm impressed that you're a county level coach - I struggle with U11s to be honest and you're well placed to give me a good honest opinion.