here is the fleshed out guidelines in the bill by the Lord Advocate

Yeah but I'm talking about the institutionalised legal situation, not the social situation.

I realise that the US constitution has been weakened in practice by Bush's anti-terrorism laws, but it still underpins and limits a lot of what the Government can & can't do.

Among other things, it gives you the legal right to offend people - which we now no longer have in Scotland.

Of course - as in any country - offending people has practical consequences as well as legal.

 

Yes, but there is certainly different degrees, and when I read some of the posts you would think Scotland was the worst, backwater shithole, and the last place any civilized, free thinker wished to live.
I never wanted to leave it in the first place, but my wife wanted to be in the States, close to her folks. Many a time I wish I was back, even with the warts it has.
Look to be offended, and you will find something, if there is a utopia ? point me in it's * direction.
It's kind of like me going to the US and saying "right you * I'm here, and if everyone doesn't bend to suit I'm going to kick up holy *".
Bit of an exaggeration, but hopefully you get my drift, and if I ever tried it, I would be promptly told, if you don't like it get back on yer boat and * off (in fact I have been told that a few times anyway).

One time when my wife was moanin to her da (who was a BA for a different union) about what an * I was, he replied....
"Say what you like but never say to me that he doesn't try for you, that boy has put with more * just being here that any man should ever have to".
The bit in my previous post was just a wee example.
Scotland aint that bad, believe me.
Sorry for the rant but sometimes I want to defend the country of my birth (doesn't mean I haven't slagged it plenty annaw).

 

Who is looking to be offended though?

 

Oh c'mon man, how many pages of moanin have we went through because we may be banned from belting out a few IRA ditties at a fitba match, and more ironic that the big baddies that supposedly have their boots on our neck have had some of theirs made illegal first. One thing we are not shy at is being offended, and claiming discrimination.
If I showed some people over here some of the comments, and told them the reason for them, they would say "this is a wind up right, you cant be serious".
Take the tints off and have a real good look for yourself.
Don't get me wrong, I first went to Parkhead in about 1964, so most of your complaints I've complained about a thousand times myself. I also know what the hun is (the scars are still here), but it is when I've stayed a while in this so called Land Of The Free, and bumped into some discrimination that has caused me quite a bit of grief, mentally and financially, that makes some of the reactions about this particular subject almost comical....IMO.
The reason I started on this rant is because one poster was bigging up the US freedom of speech laws.
Many years ago I started to say to my wife "aye freedom of speech as long as you agree wi every *". Or maybe don't care if you ever work again.

 

What an absolute * of a post.

So you say that you went to Parkhead in the 60s and you experienced the hatred and you have the scars to prove it, but since you moved to the US and got knocked back for a job somehow Scotland in your opinon isn't too bad considering, and that our problems are all in our head?

Makes sense...

 

Now, there's no need to be overpolite.

Just say what you think...

 

In hindsight it was probably a bit mean.

I stand by it though.

 

Knocked back for one job.

We could be here all night, but I know it would be pointless.
Let's just go back to what I said in a previous post and leave it at that....
Try and disrupt their National Anthem, which they play at the start of every game, of every sport, and at every stadium in the country, and see how you do.

 

BOTOB was mentioned several times by SNP MSPs at the debate the other week. It will absolutely be covered in this bill.

The whole legislation thing is a joke. I tend to think that if you're one of these folk that can't control yourself at a football match you need to take a look at yourself. If you look across at the huns and your first reaction is to shout 'IRA' you're probably immature and none-too-bright. I think that going to Manchester and chanting about the IRA in pubs etc lacks class to an almost immeasurable degree.

However, there's no way in * I think that that behaviour should be illegal. The SNP have made it illegal to be a bit of a tool at a football match.

Whether you agree or not with what the GB, or anyone else sings you surely can't want to see people given criminal records because of it. Think about that. The state have decided they don't like certain songs and phrases and so have outlawed them. It's a frankly terrifying piece of legislation and the next few months are going to be full of ridiculous charges but hopefully very few convictions.

 

Their national anthem is * as well...

 

I know, can you imagine how hard it is not to shout, GIRFU THE LOT OF YE.


Please don't take my posts the wrong way Hand, I think all this is a lot of * as well.
It's just that I think we are facing the inevitable, and will have to box clever to stop our guys getting huckled or banned. To me that will be playing right into the huns hands.

 

So its not clear to you either then

 

Taken straight from LORD ADVOCATE’S GUIDELINES ON THE OFFENSIVE BEHAVIOUR AT FOOTBALL AND THREATENING COMMUNICATIONS (SCOTLAND) BILL (AS INTRODUCED):

"the surrounding circumstances and the context in which it is being sung, the following are examples of the type of songs and lyrics which are likely to be offensive to a reasonable person.

Songs/lyrics in support of terrorist organisations
Songs/lyrics which glorifies or celebrates events involving the loss of life or serious injury.

It should be noted that in order for a criminal offence"


I guess that Flower of Scotland is now out of question in Hampden.

O Flower of Scotland,
When will we see
Your like again,
That fought and died for,
Your wee bit Hill and Glen,
And stood against him,
Proud Edward's Army,
And sent him homeward,
Tae think again.

 

well seeing as it isn't actually an official national anthem of an actual country, I don't see why not.

It's ridiculous, but that's this new bill for you!

 

TBH honest I find his choice of words on this football forum Offensive...surley this bill can work in my favour here

 

this bill is a joke really. So it will be decided on the day by the cops what is offensive and not. One song in Celtic park might be deemed offensive and another song in the * pit might not be deemed offensive all depends on the cops on the day is it.
Theirs going to be a lot of tension in the grounds over this the cops will be just waiting to arrest people.

A couple of years ago after a european match at home, I saw a cop trying to take a Palestinian flag of a guy. Because he said it was a sectarian flag and insiting hatred now that is * redicilous. Will this new law criminailise the likes of him for having such a flag or Irish flag or singing Amhrain na bhFiann.

 

Just one more nail in the coffin of Scottish Football.

 

this bill is unbelievably dangerous. it leaves so many grey areas and the bill, which brandishes cultural and politcal songs as unacceptable and offensive is, in itself offensive to scotlands minority groups and their cultural background.

celtic played 'something inside so strong' last season. under the proposed legislation, and bearing in mind that song is commerating the civil rights and anti-apartheid movement in south africa, would that be illegal?

 

According to this bill, Nelson Mandela himself is * illegal.

 

is there not a street in glasgow named after nelson mandela?

futher to this, is wearing a british legion poppy, or parading british troops at half-time considered acts 'which glorifies or celebrates events involving the loss of life or serious injury'?

i cannot get over how absurd this bill is. i really don't think legislation like this in any other self-professed free democracy would be allowed to be implemented. surely article 10 of the european convention on human rights, in relation to freedom of expression and speech, it could reasonably be argued has been breached by the proposed bill?