Do you agree with the ban on new petrol and diesel cars from 2035?

Thanks for your reply mate. I can see it making sense if you don't drive that much and you have your own driveway. Are you happy with never owning a car again? Your balloon payment at the end of your deal will be much more than the value of the car so you would be silly not to take a new deal.

Salary sacrificing to purchase an ICE car is possible as well I think.

But for anyone who does a lot of driving, for work or for road trips or traveling for sport and other hobbies, it will just not be good enough. I think it will really impact the quality of life of a lot of people in this country.

It's the mandates I have an issue with. The market will soon be flooded with cheap Chinese EVs which I don't think anyone will be happy about.

 

I know people who cover anywhere from 20-40k miles per year using and EV, and other than an initial ‘getting used to it’ phase, are absolutely fine with it and wouldn’t go back.

 

It will be suitable for some people no doubt. But a lot of people in the UK do not have a driveway and an EV will be a severe functional downgrade.

It will force people off the road. There is no getting used to that. It will hinder peoples employment opportunities and could isolate certain parts of our society.

The market is proving that most people do not want to move to EVs. Why should the governments be forcing it?

 

You have a habit of going off on tangents.

I’m simply stating that you saying “for anyone who does a lot of driving, for work or for road trips or traveling for sport and other hobbies, it will just not be good enough.” Is incorrect.

It’s good enough for people that I know who do a lot of driving.

 

It's not as straight forward as that.

The deals you get from companies doing salary sacrifice schemes often aren't the best. Some are expensive.

Salary sacrifice affects your pension contributions.

It all comes down to the deal and personal circumstances, but for a lot of people these salary sacrifice deals are nowhere near as beneficial as they sound.

 

I don't think I'm going off in a tangent, I'm just expanding my point.

Just because you know some people who do a lot of driving in EVs does not mean they are suitable for the full population and they should be mandated.

I'll expand it further on why EVs are not a suitable replacement for the majority of people.

More expensive to buy
More expensive to repair
Longer time to repair
About half the range of a standard ICE
Weighs twice as much which will have an impact on road quality
Requires 10x more water to extinguish fires
Takes a lot longer to fill to maximum range. 5 minutes in an ICE car
Not as efficient in extreme cold or heat
Will require the biggest upgrade of our energy infrastructure since it was installed
Almost fully dependent on a supply chain from China for battery mineral refining and other tech.
Environmental impact of mining minerals and the additional power required to charge them will come from fossil fuels anyway.

 

I guess here's always the option of buying a new car in 3 years time. And in 3 years the average EV will look different in battery capacity and depreciation from now. When they inevitably stop the tax breaks I wouldn't feel particularly wedded to the idea of an EV but so far I've got no reason to think about going back to petrol.

From an environmental perspective, the current contract model of 3-4 year ownership doesn't make sense and you will end up with a glut of 3-4 year old EVs worth 60-70% of what they were purchased for. But little risk from my perspective.

I don't know regarding competitiveness to be honest. But for higher tax payers it's a 44% saving between gross and net and soon to get bigger for Scots! Also a really helpful way of reducing salary for things like child benefit payments for a lot of people on tax cliffedges. But you are correct in that it's very much individual dependent.

Also, if you're talking about employer pension contributions, that will be a percentage of your gross salary so not impacted by salary sacrifice.

Given the crazy new rates of income tax coming into play in April in Scotland more people will be signing up for EV cars via salary sacrifice, and pension salary sacrifice, to reduce taxable income.

 

You stated “for anyone who does a lot of driving, for work or for road trips or traveling for sport and other hobbies, it will just not be good enough.”

I’m stating that’s not true. I know people who use EVs for high annual mileage and cope just fine.

 

You have a habit of repeating yourself to avoid having a meaningful discussion.

I also know a few people who have returned EVs as it was unusable as a car in any meaningful sense to them. I wouldn't go out my way to use that as the basis for any valid argument regarding the mandating of certain vehicles.

Do you drive yourself KoK?

 

How are you not getting this?

“for anyone who does a lot of driving, for work or for road trips or traveling for sport and other hobbies, it will just not be good enough.”

Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence, and as soon as you use terms like ‘anyone’ and speak about things in totality, you set yourself a very high bar.

I’m simply stating that you are incorrect. False. Wrong. Whatever you want to call it. I have no desire to discuss it beyond that - simply making it clear that people do in fact use EV’s and cover high mileage in them, and do so without any problems.

A quick Google search actually suggests that EV users do more miles on average than petrol and diesel drivers, which would make sense from a cost perspective.

 

* * mate. I take it you don't or can't drive.

For ANYONE that has a habit of driving over 150 miles in the one journey, having an EV will seriously effect your confidence on the road, the destinations you can go and the manner in how you drive. You drive an EV defensively with a constant eye on your range. You drive and ICE until the light comes on and you fill it up without a 2nd thought.

Some people may have a driveway with a fast charger installed. Some hotels will have charging facilities which are hopefully operational and not in use. But it's still a fundamentally different journey. There is no anxiety in an ICE car as you can refuel in 5 minutes almost anywhere in the country.

Some people may be able to live with that, but that doesn't mean it's suitable for everyone. How is that so hard to understand?

 

I'm not sure finding ways of avoiding paying a fair share of child care is a positive.

Quick figures based on a Google. Only 15% of people earn over £50,000 per year. The percentage of people that are in the higher tax band and avoid 44% tax when paying for a car is small.

I have had the conversation with too many people that don't understand the tax they pay. They think if they go above a tax threshold they automatically pay the higher percentage on all of their earnings.

Salary sacrifice does affect most pensions. The salary sacrifice is taken before deductions including pension contributions. Pension contributions are a percentage of what is left after salary sacrifice deductions.

I think that the salary sacrifice schemes confuse people. The schemes all highlight the possible percentage of tax savings, but few people have done their homework regarding the real savings.

 

I dont want to change the topic of the thread talking too much about tax. But salary sacrifice is very popular way of lowering adjusted salary to avoid tax traps. So for example someone earning 60k won't get child benefit. If they salary sacrifice 10k either though an EV contract or through additional pension contributions, or both, they reduce their salary to 50k and get child benefit. same goes for avoiding the higher tax band. It is the simplest way for most people to avoid jumps in marginal tax rates.

Granted most people don't earn above 50k, but most people don't consider buying new EVs that typically cost from 30-40k upwards. So your target market if you are selling new EVs is broadly the type of people earning that amount of money and looking to manage tax liabilities.

 

Because the bolded is not what you originally said

You’ve literally switched from “nobody can do it” to “some people can” which is what I’ve been saying from the very beginning.

 

Whats the getting used to it part waiting about services stations for hours costing a bomb?

i do 40k a year do alot of driving from North east of england to County Mayo would a EV suit me? Since u have the knowledge on this.

 

Yes.

 

thanks Kings wonderful input

 

No problem at all.

Here all night if needed. What car to buy? What colour to paint the bathroom? What to eat for breakfast?

I’m your man.

 

nice one thank you do you do blow jobs aswell