Controversial Celtic opinions

Everyone will be feart to criticise this post.

 

Yes Buster, ps are you Phil Collins (from the film Buster).

 

Nah, l would have invested my money wisely and not get caught

 

Ah good thinking.

 

I totally get that, and totally agree, mate. I think our core support do follow the team faithfully and loyally. And our values do set us apart.

I suppose that also backfires on us, though. Whether that was Celtic fans throwing bananas at Mark Walters or fans staying away in their droves when things aren't going well, it leaves us open to "What happened to faithful through and through?" Or "Taking pride in standing up for those suffering racism, bigotry and discrimination then acting like racist c***s?"

I know the Mark Walters incident was 35 years ago, but it still happened and it was still done by fans who claimed they were better than that.

In our defence, every fanbase will have a percentage of morons and the bigger the fanbase, the bigger the percentage of morons.

I think the majority of our fans these days are actually progressive/left wing and a good representation of Celtic's original core values and founding principles; I also believe that our club is more than just a club, and throughout our history, most of the fans got that and got what it meant to be a Celtic fan.

Those who get what it means to support Celtic don't need an explanation. Those who don't get will never, ever understand any explanation

 

In my opinion the mark Walters thing was more an attack on a better player going to rangers and at that time horrendous as it looks now was probably less so at that time given the nature of how the world is going ,the nature of fans and rivals is to attack with the first and basic instinct to create the most damage and by damage I mean put them off their game , luckily we have seen big changes in this kind of thing especially at our club .

 

Great Post mate and totally agree with it all.

Love that last paragraph!!

The Mark Walters thing is horrible! 35 years ago but still mental. I was only a buck at the time so probably didn't know the relevance of it all.
What I will say even early 90s I used some language and linguistics I am totally ashamed of now, there was no excuse for it. Thankfully I learned from it and one of my proudest moments was being on the BNP email hit list .

What makes me cringe is so called Celtic fans displaying homophobia, sexism, racism, sectarianism and just ignorant behaviours to minorities....they should be hounded from our fan base.

 

I don't see how it was simply an attack on a better player. It was down to race.

He was a victim of relentless racism at Ibrox as well - they had to ban season ticket holders for racially abusing him, so it's clear it was non-football related.

Everywhere he went he was racially abused. That includes Parkhead. It was unacceptable for a club like Celtic, which has been the victim of far-right anti-immigrant racism since its foundation, to have supporters openly indulging in that kind of reprehensible behaviour.

 

Have to disagree, bud.
It was absolutely race motivated and completely unacceptable. What made it worse was the fact we claimed to be against all that, especially given our own history.

However, I do agree that as a support (in general) we were better than that and certainly are better than that now

 

Spot on!

 

Love the fact the BNP c***s hated you ... I'd certainly be wearing that as a badge of honour, mate.

Yeah, that stuff gives me the cringe, too. And it does make you think of those supporters "and if you know your history!" Eh?

 

No surprise seeing Joe now trying to defend racism.

 

Throwing bananas at him was an attack on his playing skills? Now that is * bananas.

Shameful behaviour by those involved and unfortunately more just a small minority as we often like to provide as an excuse.

Fortunately time moves on and we are far removed from that place now.

 

I really dislike the groupthink behind the support's collective moral stance on contemporary political issues. It has nothing to do with being a Celtic fan in my book.

Being a Celtic fan carries with it certain common identities, like being of Irish descent and Catholic, which in turn entails certain political stances regarding Irish independence. But progressive politics in no way follows logically from that, in fact it's pretty much at odds with the rigidly traditionalist Catholic values that our club has historically been associated with. The attempt to bandwagon incompatible political stances to the club's identity is a turn-off for me.

 

What would you consider incompatible contemporary moral/political stances, though, bud?

Being of Irish descent, as many of us are, isn't it natural for us to oppose the prejudice, racism and discrimination in today's society that our ancestors faced?

Celtic was founded by Irish Catholics, primarily to feed Irish Catholic children in Glasgow's east end, but also as a club open to all, who drew support far, far beyond those small area of Glasgow.

Being open to all is a statement of inclusion, and rejecting the Catholics only policy of Hibs, and fielding Protestants, showed a progressive attitude from our earliest days

 

That just sounds more like you have a personal issue with certain modern politics.

A collective outlook as a support is unrealistic and even though this forum is a tiny representation of the wider support, you can see how divided the fans are on many issues.

 

Well, there's a couple of things I don't like about it.

First, I don't like the groupthink aspect to it. I really didn't like when the GB made the banner criticising Rod Stewart, like no Tories at Parkhead. I don't vote Tory but it's not for anyone else to tell me how I should vote or what makes a Celtic fan. I disagree that being of Irish descent means we ought to have monolithic views on politics, I think that's actually quite a regressive way of thinking.

Second, it's also just not an accurate description of our support. It's true that historically we've been quite radical politically, but it's untrue that our support are characterised by progressive views. Taking the issue of race above, I've heard appalling things on the terraces, in the supporter's clubs, on the bus, wherever. A room full of people screaming slurs at some black player on the telly. We're progressive as compared with the * knuckledraggers in the other half of the city but that's not setting the bar very high.

And third, there is a part of it that I feel is moving away from the actual core values of our club. Like our club was founded by a priest on Catholic values and there's certain places you can't go in terms of modern progressivism without dumping that. I think that identity means less and less to younger generations and they're sort of trying to replace it with values they prefer, but I think you risk losing something fundamental to our club in that process.

It doesn't keep me up at night or anything but I just don't care for the association.

 

I have been a Celtic fan since the 60s and as much as I fit the profile of Irish catholic decent lived in the south side of Glasgow

but what I did when I was at matches 40 years ago is not what I would do now things change people grow life experiences change you, people you meet change you. I cringe at some of the things I see or hear now

yet 40 + years ago in the Jungle I was front and centre for most of it.

 

In terms of Irish independence, the pursuit of it is heavily rooted in socialist politics & thinking, walk around any Nationalist area of the 6 counties & the vast majority of the people you talk to will have the same values as our support.

 

You make some really good points, and it's definitely a good discussion. I'll get back to you this evening after work, bud