Aaron Mooy

But did Ange ever say we will have a DM "solution" or is this a demand that has been concocted by Celtic fans and completely irrelevant to our gaffer's plan?

 

There was a lengthy transfer saga regarding a physical DM.

 

For me the links with guys like Mooy and even Davies are suspect, suspect in that these moves suit the player and could highly likely come from their agents approaching the club rather than the other way about. Nothing against Mooy as a player.

We definitely need a CDM and our games against Aberdeen in phase 8/15 I think, our win against Fenecvaros away and our win against Betis show where Ange played Bitton shows this. You could even go so far as to loosely extrapolate that around 50% of Ange's biggest results at Celtic have been played with a CDM. With Champs league it could be considered that every game will need that pragmatic approach unless one team in the group is of a lesser quality than Fenecvaros which is unlikely.

Again, nothing against Mooy however with 4+ players able to play the two advanced midfield roles (CalMac moving half a position forward for big games), it seems unnecessary and likely one player will get very little game time.

Time is most definitely on our side with six weeks to go and months before we have any games in which a CDM of real quality is a must in the starting lineup.

 

I agree that we should trust Ange because he has earned that, but what will you say if we do sign a CDM? Ange says a lot of things, including talking down signing Mooy but here we are.

I don't think anybody is suggesting that we buy a big brute that can't play football, but it's obvious we need somebody that can soak up some pressure in there for high intensity games. The huns ran over our midfield on a few occasions last season.

If Ange really doesn't think it's a priority then I think a lot of people would be slightly concerned by that.

 

I'll rephrase it better. He NEEDS to be pragmatic in Europe. That should just be a given. I like Ange and I like his style of play but guess what? I loved Brendan Rodgers and his style of play too.... until it came to Europe. Getting smashed 5 and 6 puff because you don't want to break from your philosophy isn't pragmatic. At times I * hated watching Neil Lennons teams but guess what? He was pragmatic in Europe for the most of it and mostly always changed his formation to counter the opposition. Prime example of this would be playing his usual 4-3-3 in the home game against Lazio, which we won 2-1 and then changing it a week later against the same opposition and playing a 3-5-2 and winning again 2-1. Ange just doesn't do that. Neither did Rodgers. It cost us.

This is a totally different kettle of fish next year as well. We were unlucky with our group last year, we had two decent teams who could play. The reality is we went out to dominate the game and we didn't and we conceded goals left right and centre. This is the * elite. This is teams who are smashing the guys who smashed us last year. PSG/Bayern Munich/Real Madrid/Man City/Liverpool.

He did get a free hit at Europe because of how poor we were at the start of the season but we weren't just poor in the European games. After we beat Rangers 2-1 at Mordor, Rangers completely changed the way they played us. They started going physical, trying to rough us up. Guess what? It worked. They knocked us out of the cup a couple of weeks later and probably should have beaten us at Celtic Park in the final derby game. We got some luck, played well in our spells and ultimately, done what we needed. It's different this year though. This is a new season, we all start from scratch again.

I absolutely gave him a free hit in Europe though. I rememeber travelling up to the Bodo/Glimt game saying to my mum on the way "ken, I don't really give a * about tonight, the league is the priority" but see after the game? I was * raging. Playing O'Riley and Rogic in the same team was a * disaster waiting to happen. I like that about Ange though, he's not afraid to come out and say he got it wrong, on occasion. He done it during the first derby when we were beaten 1-0 and he done it after the Bodo game, fair play. Managers make mistakes.

The big thing for me is, over the last 2 years we have lost Scott Brown, our captain and another physically dominate player in the team and now Nir Bitton, who for all his faults at times, certainly wasn't afraid to get stuck in and battle in the middle of the park. Had Bitton been staying this year, I don't think we would have been badly needing one like we are now. We just don't have one. You want midfielders who do different things. The same way we have two entirely different strikers up front. One who is small, quick and incredible at making these sort of in behind runs, like Kyogo and Giakoumakis, a massive, dominant powerhouse who roughs up defenders, brings us up the pitch when we are under the cosh and wins us some fouls.

Every team in the world needs someone in there who can give you a bit of dig and it's already been said before, the best teams in the world with the best players all have that physically dominant DM who sits and patrols the back 4 so that gives the freedom of others to do what they need to do at the other end of the pitch.

On the Aaron Mooy comment. I don't think Mooy plays much and I would be * raging if he starts playing games at the expense of Hatate/Turnbull/O'Riley. These guys are the future and bringing in a 31 year old who's barely kicked a ball for 2 years is fine for a squad filler and to bring on and rest some of the guys in the odd match. Not to be a starter in most of our games. Not a chance.

 

Would you be raging if we still had Rogic and he started some games?

 

I wouldn't be raging, No. But Tom Rogic made the right choice in moving on because I believe we purchased his replacement in January. Did I want Tom to leave? No but if you're asking me who I think should start in the attacking midfield positions next year, I wouldn't have said Rogic had he stayed.

Completely two different situations as well, I don't really know where you were going with that comment to be honest.

 

Apart from the last paragraph, you’ve nailed it.

 

The only issue I have with any of this is... you call your mum Ken?

 

* shafted me there, pal. Well played

Horrendous grammar/punctuation on this from me over the last couple of days.

 

Do you disagree about where Mooy fits into the squad? I just don't see where he plays. Seems to have dropped further back over the years, to a 6 and he isn't playing in front of McGregor... if we push McGregor further forward to include him, I worry what sort of message that sends to the younger guys. They're not good enough? When we know, all 3 of them are certainly good enough and have made more than their fair share of contributions to the team over the last 6 months/Year.

 

It seems strange to me that you wouldn't rage at Rogic but would at Mooy, despite the fact that every Aussie on this forum, and evidently our gaffer too, thinks Mooy is a better player than Rogic.

 

Rogic had been at the club for 9 years and gave us some of the greatest memories in recent times. Loyalty probably has something to do with that, to a certain extent and it's not like Tam didn't do anything last year. He played very well. His time as a first teamer was ending though and it was the right choice for him to go. I've said on a previous thread, before Tam announced that he was leaving, I would have liked to see one of Turnbull/Rogic leave so we could bring in someone slightly different for the attacking midfield role. At the time, we were heavily linked to Christopher Scott from Bayern Munich and he seemed quick/agile and I thought that would have been a good thing to add as a number 10, given the 3 we had last year are slower.

So, yeah. A guy spending pretty much the majority of his career with us would have been ok and had he been playing the odd game to rest O'Riley and cover for Turnbull, no problem. It's different bringing in a money grabber from China who's barely played for 2 years though. He's cover for McGregor... that's basically where I see him playing.

 

I am not totally against us signing Mooy. The deal is decent for us, short term and free = very little risk. Plus its a player Anger trusts. However I am disappointed because signing Mooy means we probably won’t be going for someone like Michut who would/could be class for us for years.

 

So for sentimentality you would tolerate Rogic, but bringing in a better player on a freebie, will cause you outrage. Fair enough then, at least you're honest.

 

Missing the point as a whole but yeah, you're good at doing that.

 

That's true, but Michut is also an unknown quantity and inexperienced. We have lots of prospects to sell for the future, like Abada, Jota, Kenny, etc.

With Mooy we're bringing in a guy who might not have Europe experience, but he has over 50 caps for his national team, including at the World Cup and a goal against Brazil. So that experience could be more useful in CL campaigns then a Michut.

 

Says the guy who continually thinks he knows how Mooy will be used by Ange because he hasn't realised what he wants doesn't translate into what the manager will do.

 

I don’t agree with it solely on the fact that I don’t know.

Mooy could come in and cement a place, or he could be a useful sub, squadfiller, waste of space.

I’m not writing him off at all until I see him play for CELTIC.

 

I don't get why you seem to put so much emphasis on playing at a world cup some diddies have played at the world cup also North Korea scored against Brazil at a world cup so it's not really something that should be considered for taking a player in. Mooy is the wrong side of 30 hasn't played a lot of football in the past 2/3 years will more than likely take some time to get up to speed and is coming in to a position we're already sorted for numbers in.

We've needed a defensive mid who would tackle their granny for to long now even before Ange we've been slaughtered in Europe for essentially being to nice. Rodgers refusal to change how we played in Europe was his downfall as well. We need to be more pragmatic especially in the Champions League not saying if we are we will win every game but we can avoid some drubbings.