Ange Postecoglou

The exact same man.

The revisionism on that remark is cringe worthy but the article I linked does say everything we're feeling.

A broken clock is right twice a day.

 

Same here, I can't stand him and 95% of the time, he's full of *. However, it is difficult to argue with anything he's written here.

 

Why are we waiting until the end to have some attempts on goal? I wouldnt call them world class either. Expected saves, were just not used to seeing a keeper who saves shots that are half decent. The goal against us should have been saved. It was centre goal.

This mess is the boards fault. We needed recruitment in, time to gel and become a team. We got no recruitment, we've lost another player and the leagues started so have zero time to gel. Fact is, leagues done. There's too much now. Weve just handed £40m to the opposition. Now watch us also be out spent 10 fold. So hopefully we keep up as our team builds and grows together since the average age is about 9 n a half with the odd teenager. Its too big an ask. Remove head of recruitment, new ceo, new manager. Yes we need to dismantle to rebuild better. Just have no faith they have a clue how to rebuild better.

 

If the opposition keeper didn't pull off the two world class saves at the death, would that have meant we magically played well, that the subs were magically made 20 mins earlier, that Forrest had actually switched to the right side in the first half?



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Ange getting some harsh treatment I think. Although this is to be expected, Celtic fans are some of the most fickle, reactionary fans about.

We went into Midtjylland severely unprepared. Actually that's an understatement. I don't think we've ever been less ready for a European qualifier and that's saying something. Pretty much all of us expected a defeat and if it wasn't for Bitton's stupidity and Barkas' ineptitude we'd be in the next round. The second leg wasn't that great but we only lost by 1 goal on the whole.

Hearts was frustrating but we should have beat them too (dominated the game, offside goal chalked off, Gordon turning into Banks at the end). We need to give him time before we start calling for his head. He's been here for one month ffs. I swear some fans have massive chips on their shoulders about relatively unknown managers managing Celtic. It was the same with Deila, people just look for reasons to criticise. Its like they can't wait to stick the boot. Ange needs our support not the pitchforks.

I've already been more impressed with our performances this season that any of ours under Lennon/Kennedy last term. I know that isn't saying much, but Lennon was given a pass for way too long despite continuously churning out atrocious performances. We were a disgrace last season from game one - Lennon decimated any playing style and identity we had under Rodgers. Confidence was at an all time low, we've lost multiple players (yet to replace), others don't want to be here (yet to sell), our transfers have been diabolical, we have no scouting set up and a board who doesn't give a *, two goalkeepers who couldn't catch water if they fell out of a boat, no strikers currently worthy of a place in the squad, same with the fullbacks..

People thinking this will be a quick fix are utterly delusional, biggest rebuild in our history and we've still done nothing about it.. Blame Ange but! He's Australian! He couldn't have inherited a worse squad at a worse time than this.

Let's judge him in 12 months

 

Don't think it's fickle or harsh to judge him on a game by game basis, as you said yourself, the hearts game we should have won, we dominated etc.
The fact we didn't win, someone needs to take responsibility for that, and with responsibility comes blame.

Think everyone is agreed though that midytjlland was disappointing, but understandable considering how poor the backline was.

But for hearts, we had two CBS who have been over the course.

On the whole, Ange isn't being blamed for the mess we are in and for the time he gets benefit of the doubt, but it doesn't absolve him from mistakes on a per game basis, such as late subs, persisting with players (Forrest) out of position, not instilling more intensity.


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So, just to confirm, you guys have openly said,"worst Celtic team in years", "Defensive options are shambolic", "No keepers worth a pinch of *", "Strikers that are either rubbish or don't try", "Board is a disgrace and don't care", "MUST be given time because it's a massive job" etc etc etc and you've got a new manager that's just come in with an obvious remit to rebuild a squad and return the club to it's previous stature that has had one short training camp and a week before a home and away CL leg and the first league game lose the CL qualifiers in extra time by 1 goal with a player missing an absolute howler that would have won it and lose in the first game of the league 2-1 to what you've acknowledged is an achilles heel of set pieces because of no height in defence etc etc and some of your responses are "out of his depth", "tactically inept", "doesn't understand Scottish football", "where's Angeball"?

It's laughable really that the manager hasn't come into the club, in crisis, with a shithouse squad, that's just sold it's BEST defender (and arguably player), lost some of it's other best players including GK, who has it's best striker wanting away and is coming off a season (or a few) of utter neglect and hasn't turned it all around in 4 whole weeks???

Seriously, I understand the trepidation about whether he's up to it for you guys even though I have no doubt whatsoever he is, and I understand the passion and frustration of watching the club decline through poor management (trust me, I'm also a Villa supporter!! Randy Lerner anyone?), BUT you're simply not going to wave a magic wand and right the wrongs overnight. He WILL rebuild your squad, he WILL implement a playing style that is successful and good to watch and he WILL continue to be a straight shooter to any and all including media and the board etc etc which is why his players and supporters love and respect him but the guy needs a realistic amount of time to make that happen.

He will always take responsibility for the losses, even at this stage and will work his * off to turn it around.

Also, you understand that other teams around the world realise to play long balls to corners when fullbacks press high to get him behind as well don't you? It's not the first time his teams have encountered it and they've still managed to be successful so I wouldn't worry he's being "outthought tactically" when it happens, stick with him, I think just maybe he'll surprise you.

Cheers

 

So you didn't watch the hearts game then?


Everyone and their dug is backing him and wants him to do well, we all know he is needing time, we all know he doesn't have his players in yet, he's made enough noise about that himself.


But all of that and all the stuff you've said means * all, when in the actual game itself, he made managerial mistakes.

It is that simple, he made mistakes on Saturday night, he has owned up to that and he is rightly getting criticism for that, only that.

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This was the team he inherited in Brisbane half way through the season
Pos Team Pld W D L GF GA GD Pts Qualification or relegation
1 Sydney FC (C) 27 15 3 9 35 23 +12 48 Finals series and 2011 AFC Champions League group stage
2 Melbourne Victory 27 14 5 8 47 32 +15 47
3 Gold Coast United 27 13 5 9 39 35 +4 44 Finals series
4 Wellington Phoenix 27 10 10 7 37 29 +8 40
5 Perth Glory 27 11 6 10 40 34 +6 39
6 Newcastle Jets 27 10 4 13 33 45 −12 34
7 North Queensland Fury 27 8 8 11 29 46 −17 32
8 Central Coast Mariners 27 7 9 11 32 29 +3 30
9 Brisbane Roar 27 8 6 13 32 42 −10 30
10 Adelaide United 27 7 8 12 24 33 −9 29

He shipped out guys that people thought he was crazy to get rid of that you may have heard of, Craig Moore, Danny Tiatto, Charlie Miller, Bob Malcolm (my * he was dreadful) as well as some others and brought in players HE found and chased from as far abroad as Germany (Thomas Broich), like literally drove for hours to meet them and convince them of what he was building. This was the same team the following year after ONE window and a pre season

Pos Team Pld W D L GF GA GD Pts Qualification or relegation
1 Brisbane Roar (C) 30 18 11 1 58 26 +32 65 Finals series and 2012 AFC Champions League group stage[a]
2 Central Coast Mariners 30 16 9 5 50 31 +19 57
3 Adelaide United 30 15 5 10 51 36 +15 50 Finals series and 2012 AFC Champions League qualifying play-off
4 Gold Coast United 30 12 10 8 40 32 +8 46 Finals series
5 Melbourne Victory 30 11 10 9 45 39 +6 43
6 Wellington Phoenix 30 12 5 13 39 41 −2 41
7 Newcastle Jets 30 9 8 13 29 33 −4 35
8 Melbourne Heart 30 8 11 11 32 42 −10 35
9 Sydney FC 30 8 10 12 35 40 −5 34
10 Perth Glory 30 5 8 17 27 54 −27 23
11 North Queensland Fury 30 4 7 19 28 60 −32 19

Ange Postecoglou arrived mid-season armed with the task of picking up the pieces of a season in tatters. Postecoglou's first season ended as the worst in the club's short history, finishing second from the bottom. Postecoglou completed a turn-around in the 2010–11 season. He made wholesale changes to the squad, commencing with the replacement of the "old-guard" of Charlie Miller, Craig Moore and Danny Tiatto and brought in his own squad which was a mixture of youth and talented experience. Under his brand of possession/attacking football, he led the team to win the club's inaugural premiership and go on to complete the club's first Double by also wrapping up the championship in a memorable 2011 A-League Grand Final in front of a then club record 50,168 supporters. The club went on an Australian sporting record 36-match unbeaten run which commenced in the 2010–11 season and ran through to the 2011–12 season. After much speculation on his future at the club, it was reported that Postecoglou had signed a three-year contract extension.[16]

With such a successful season behind him, there was much talk as to whether the Roar could equal or better that in the 2011–12 season.[citation needed] Their title credentials were in doubt when the club went on a club-record worst losing streak of five matches immediately following the ending of their record 36-match unbeaten streak. Postecoglou remained steadfast in the club's footballing philosophy and the club went on to record just one loss in the last 14 games of the regular season to finish league runners-up. Unable to retain the Premiers Plate, Postecoglou led the club to back-to-back championships in the 2012 A-League Grand Final in front of a club-record 50,344 supporters.


He did much the same at Yokohama, taking the side over with mixed success for the balance of the season, one window and some time and won the league the following season. My guess is the board is looking for him to rebuild, knowing what a shambles they're in and if he gets some time and the backing in a window I guess we'll see what happens. If not, you'll get to say I told you so and he'll go to another club.....and be successful once again no doubt.

 

I watched the game absolutely and I see a side lacking in cohesion that is still learning to play a new style. I see players that are poor that need to be upgraded (a few that have already been mentioned mainly), players just arriving lacking in touch (Starfelt was poor) and I see a striker that has a bit of magic about him when he wants to but who's workrate is terrible. I'm not saying he won't make mistakes, any manager in football will make them, but he'll own them just the same. I'm suggesting however that people saying he's "out of his depth", "doesn't understand Scottish Football" etc etc are kidding themselves.

 

Welcome to Celtic! Lol

I said this before and when he was appointed, it’s going to take time for everything to take shape. Even if he had made 10 signings right now, it still takes time to adapt to his tactics and get up to speed. This is not an overnight job.

We’ve seen in flashes what Ange is trying to do and I still believe he is going to be successful here but it’s not going to be until January IMO that we are fully up to speed.

I do believe we will gradually get more and more competitive and start winning games very soon, we just needs a few players that have an actual interest, a good keeper, right back and left back and a striker that wants to be here that can finish, maybe that’s Kyogo but I’d like another striker as well.

 

100% mate, agree with all of that!

I completely understand the frustration with the club and the thirst for quick results, I support Brisbane here in Oz the side he took over and we were the same, just a frustration to watch. Even after he took over we were still average for some time as things were implemented but after the window that meant some personnel changes and the time to work with the squad the difference was remarkable.

I guess what I mean is he's no short term bandaid to get some quick results to look good, he'll genuinely do what he thinks is best for the club long term and that will take a little time. He'll * HATE losing at all times so will be driving it as hard as he can though, I guarantee that.

 

Lack of cohesion is certainly a big issue right now, as is players not for for the style he wants.

However a simple fix to that was to switch Forrest to his natural, cohesive side.

It's a new style, but it's not reinventing the sport, these are still players on the whole who have won league title up against a newly promoted side.

It's a tough arena in historic matches, but it should have been a win.

No Celtic fan should accept that defeat, specially not when there was at least 3 easy fixes during the game to combat the lack of tempo, intensity, attacking prowess that doesn't need a whole new squad, just the right game management.

He has inherited a club that's fallen on bad times, he hasn't inherited a league 2 side punching above its weight against a newly promoted hearts.

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What mistakes did he own up to?

 

When your that high up as Taylor has been I don’t think defensive positional sense matters


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Agree it's not reinventing the sport completely and I guess why frustrated when it gets suggested about his lack of understanding for the league or situation. He will have done his homework guaranteed, he's not naive when it comes to football or teams in different leagues as seems to be getting suggested (not by yourself) and there will be no-one more frustrated by the result than he will be regardless of opposition and situation. He'll want to win every game regardless but will also have belief in the long term goal for the side.

His sides are known for tempo of ball (and player) movement and looking to play positive forward balls and that just isn't happening often enough at the moment but I have no doubt it will.

You obviously know the side far better than me but on the surface it appears to have lost quite a chunk of quality and experience from the last season or two apart from CalMac, Forrest and Odsonne.

 

It is possible to accept that he’s been dealt as bad a hand as you can get whilst criticising him for some of his decisions on a game by game basis. It doesn’t have to be one or the other.

The persistence with Edouard who is a mere pitiful shadow of the player we once knew, dropping Christie for Forrest when he’s been one of our better players, bringing on a sub in the 92nd minute when it could have been used when the game was level.

I would say he hasn’t covered himself in glory thus far but it’s early days.

 

Above in bold.

Now is not the time to "learn to play a new style". Celtic at the moment are a team that struggles with the basics. For example, the atrocious defending of set plays.

Ange must adapt double quick, and be pragmatic. There is no other way.

 

Worrying lack of transfers activity it would seem from the outside, hopefully I’m wrong. Thought after the CL exit we would move a bit quicker but not even a peep.

 

I honestly think very few Celtic fans would care about those things had Postecoglou got the win.

Any loss is bad loss, ten fold for Celtic fans, but the there is progress in the way the team is playing, player quality notwithstanding.