Will/is Neil Lennon as good as Gordon Strachan at Celtic.

I think if wgs had got the support from the fans and board that lennon has then he could have done even better than he did and may still be our manager.....so i would say we will never know who is better as they have not been treated on a even playing field.

 

And what is the difference in support the board gives to Lennon from what Strachan got?

 

There's none, Gordon Strachan spent the same amount of money as Martin O'Neill in the end. It'll take a * of a lot of money in the next two years for Lenny too match that...

Doesn't matter though the simple answer is this, right now he's not better. He will surpass him in league titles won, in Europe it's a mystery just now but I'm fairly confident.

Gordon Strachan was a man who excelled under being the underdog, that worked well for him in Europe. Not so much when we were expected to win though. As seen against Aalborg.

We'll see with Neil. Far too early to say so but the signs are good so far.

 

Strachan came to celtic at a time when the team was getting old and his job was to break it up and cut the wages of the big players.
Lennon is here at a time when is is aloud to build up a team and improve teams wages,i dont recall wgs getting to give CL money to his best player in wages in order to keep them and try and build a better team.

And if you think the fans gave wgs the same support they give lennon then your blind,you only need to look at some of the threads on here to see the difference.

 

Not on wages he didn't. Strachan cut out around 30-40 millions worth of debt while succeeding in the CL etc.

 

Very true

 

I am confident now with Lennon as manager, at the start i was worried because he was inexperienced and it showed in matches, especially the european games.

What a difference a scottish cup makes... he has the bhoys playing good football, the team work for him,the fans and each other. His signing poilcy is good and effective, for me hes on par with Strachan and lacks only sustained european success to surpass Strachan and MON.

He's spent 7 million on Izaguirre (600k), Hooper (2 million), Kayal (1.2 million), Wanyama (900k), Ledley (Bosman), Matthews (Bosman), Mulgrew (Bosman), Commons (300k), Forster (2 million)

 

Strachan took over an old, creaking squad and had to make drastic changes while maintaining the success of his predecessor - which he did.

Gordon deserves a * of a lot of credit for the job he did here, however boring and sterile the football was, which manifested itself in a very poor final season. The side lacked a spark, particularly towards the end of his tenure. But he organised us well, brought us trophies and gave us some memorable European nights.

However, I feel Lennon has given us a more exciting squad and his signings overall have been very good.
He has all the raw materials to be a success as a manager, and has needed to go through a process of being 'hardened' as boss as well as calming down.

The signs are very, very good. He has faith in young players, and seems to have found a formula for success in Europe based on recent games.

Time will ultimately tell.

 

I never actually mentioned the fans, but if you think Lennon is totally adored as a manager then perhaps it's you who is blind - all you need to do is look back at some of the threads/posts in here when Lennon was appointed, or infact at ANY thread when Celtic have been beaten......plenty of negative "get him tae *" posts.

 

There was get him to * threads for the whole time wgs was in charge......not celtic minded springs to mind.

 

And then you just have to look at the praise he is getting in this thread alone.

So would you agree that both managers have had wanted/unwanted criticism?

 

Thats utter nonsence mate.

Strachan came into a team were several top performers were already in place...

??????
?????? Balde ?????? ??????
McGeady Petrov Lennon Maloney
Hartson ??????

Fringe players - McManus, Marshall, Beattie, Pearson and Wallace.

And a couple who were past their best but still decent, Varga, Agathe, Thompson and Sutton who he let go within the year. He added Boruc, Telfer, Virgo, Wilson, Camara, Nakamura and Zurawski and then Keane and Dublin.

He could have done what he wanted, he could have done a Lennon and signed younger up and coming players to fit round that base he had for atleast 1 season but he usually went for older experienced players to build his own team.

Lennon came into a team with this in place:

??????
?????? ?????? ?????? ??????
?????? Brown ?????? ??????
?????? ??????

Fringe players Rogne, Wilson, Ki, Crosas, Samaras


Our 3 best players Boruc, McGeady and Hinkel all wanted to leave and did(except Hinkel who done his knee and missed the whole year and then left)

Lennon brought in mostly young players Forster, Cha, Majstorovic, Izaguirre, Juarez, Kayal, Ledley, Murphy Stokes and Hooper and then Commons and Ljungberg.

Lennon wasnt "allowed" to build up a team, he had to do it as there was nobody left and he chose to do it using younger players, so could Strachan have.

Strachan never really reduced the wagebill either, the wagebill the season before he came in was £37million and the wagebill when he left was £39million.

O'Neill's average wagebill was £34million a year, Strachans was £36.5million a year.

Its a common misconception that O'Neill's teams had a massive wage-bill but O'Neill only had a core squad of about 14 players after that he used the Youth team. Where as Strachan had a squad of about 20 players throughout his time. The wagebill in the Mowbray season was £36.4million, in Lennon's first season it was £32.6million, down almost £4million. The wagebill now compared to Strachans last 2 seasons is down £6/7million a year.

The wagebill has went like this...

2008 £38.9million (Strachan)
2009 £39million (Strachan)
2010 £36.4million (Mowbray)
2011 £32.6million (Lennon)
2012 ? - Probably similar since players like Crosas, McGowan, Maloney, Hooiveld and Hinkel left and some went out on loan like Murphy, O'Dea, Thompson, McGinn, Rasmussen, Juarez etc while only Ibrahim, Lustig, Wanyama, Matthews, Wilson and Bangura signed and only a couple of players got a new contract.

The wagebill this season will probably be down again with Cha, Wilson, Majstorovic, Loovens, O'Dea, Rasmussen, Juarez, Ki, McGinn, Thompson, Cervi all leaving and Murphy, Bangura etc going on loan with only Ambrose, Miku, Forster, Lassad and Kamenar signing.
​

 

Great post ILoveTheCeltic.


I don't think Lennon will be able to get us to the last 16 due to constraints surrounding the club in general at the moment, but that doesn't mean WGS will always automatically the better manager just because he did it. A statistic i like to compare the two is that in WGS 4 season his team scored 4 goals at Ibrox, Lennons team scored 4 at ibrox over his first two visits there as a manager. As a stat this could be coincidental, but its not - it summarises the difference in mentality the two teams had. Aslong as Lennon can keep his team motivated to win the next 3 titles, and more importantly with the same quality and style of football he has used so far, then in my opinion he will be better. That is what will always go against WGS regardless of what he acheived, his football wasn't great at all - whereas i have really enjoyed watching NL's team.

There has been alot of manager debate on here recently about MON v WGS v NL, all regards to their best acheivements, (namely the Treble & Seville, 3IAR & the two last 16s and whatever Lennon will acheive in his time here) but i love remembering that NL was involved in all of these successes. So i think there will come a time when we will analyse what overall contribution(Not achievements) to the club has been made by each of them that will read like NL>MON>WGS.

 

??????
?????? Balde ?????? ??????
McGeady Petrov Lennon Maloney
Hartson ??????

WGS's team when he arrived. OK, Petrov was on his way and Lennon and Hartson on their way out along with the likes of Agathe, Sutton and McNamara. Other than Stan, I don't think any of these players did anything after leaving which proved it was right to get shot of them all and their wages. I've made my feelings clear on what kind of footballer I see Balde as and thankfully WGS was aware of this or we wouldn't have got near to the last 16.

So having sold Petrov, WGS was able to bring in the likes of Naka and Boruc, two amazing signings and without spending much more, managed to put a team on the park after a season which could compete in the CL.

The obvious downside was the money and wages wasted on Graveson who contributed very little in his time at the club although he did manged to score a vital goal or two.

 

Of course you know these sums how....?????? your on the board of celtic fc.......ur a agent for every player listed......?????? you pulled these sums out your *......yeah i know what one i would go for.
Lets be honest here no one other than celtic fc and the players know what wages are being payed.to try and quote amounts is just daft.

 

I think all managers since MON have been working under tight constraints with maybe a slight easing off that will let lennon reward some players bigger contracts by using some of the CL cash to pay for it.
But we can be sure it will only be the players with big sell on fees that will get the cash.

 

Again you use the word bitterness. Where is the bitterness in my post?? Lennon was my favourite player for years, even when he was getting unfairly slated for long spells which many seem to have forgotten. As a manager i think he and this team are overrated by many on this forum, thats just my opinion and i have stated this. Im not hiding behind halftruths, its just my opinion which im not afraid to share so where the bitterness comes in i just dont have a clue???

On to the signings you are talking about, you thought Lennon "has been an unequivocal success and the best manager in Britain in terms of transfers". I disagreed with that and brought up some of his not so good signings including a few loan ones but also Juarez, Big Maj, Murphy, Bangura, Cha and Ljunberg. I havnt forgotten about the decent signings he has made but they are still unproven for me and we will see how good these players are when they are tested at the top level in a few weeks. To say he has been an "unequivocal sucess" in the transfer market for me is wrong as he has had plenty signings who havnt done the business for us. Again though just my opinion and nothing bitter in that.

I never said we only beat them once that season. If you read my post correctly i stated when we overturned the 15 point gap on Rangers we only beat them once so overturning the 15 point gap so quickly was as much down to their poor form as our good form. Scoring 4 goals at Ibrox means absolutly nothing when you get beat twice there so dont know your bringing that up as some sort of achievement?? Your spot on we had overtook them before they got deducted the points but it basically killed the title when they did get them deducted and there for took the pressure of us and handed us the title months before the end of the season.

I have never claimed that you think Lennon is better Strachan. Not once have i ever claimed you said that.

You say in time that you have no doubt that Lennon will be better than Strachan. Well i hope you are right as that would mean we are in for some good times ahead. In the meantime can we not just give our opinion without being called bitter???

 

Im not sure we will ever come to a answer with who is the best,lennon has time on his side as he could be here for much longer than the other two and the death of the huns for atleast 5years is going to help his case greatly.

But what a great time we have had since MON took over with the TM aside we have been rather lucky and won many great things and had loads of great nights in europe.

Meanwhile over in follow follow land they have threads like....WHO * OUR CLUB THE MOST.:bbpd::bbpd:

 

Dont know how people think he will be better, celtic have not got the same resources now.