Ki

An assist relies pretty much on the skill of two players and one incident (the assist leading to the goal)

Win percentage involves 22 other players (plus subs) over 90 minutes.

It is much easier to infer someone from the former than it is from the latter.

 

An assist relies upon at least three players; the player who scores, the player who assists, and the player who plays the ball to the assisting player. You could even argue that the stat relies on the 22 men on the field and the formation used because all of these variables affect a players likelihood of getting an assist.

Obviously as I said before no stat should be used in isolation and if my eyes tell me something different I believe my eyes. For example Commons has had quite a few assists this year but he hasn't played very well imo. In Ki's case the stats back up what I thought long before I actually did the numbers, we struggle to win with Ki in the team.

 

Your eyes, along with mine and most likely the vast majority of the Celtic support back up the damning statistics against Ki. Still there are some on this forum who continue to defend the indefensible about Ki, and continue to bury their heads in the sand like an ostrich, oblivious and stubborn to the overwhelming empirical evidence which states that we lose too many games or draw them when Ki plays as a central midfielder in our team.This is not a new phenomena with Ki either, this disturbing trend has been in evidence during Ki's entire three year stay with the club.This is a stand out feature of Ki in both the stats and our empirical senses which is incontrovertible and irrefutable evidence that Ki is a liability in our team

 

nice vocab

 

100% correct. He is said to be some kind of new Xavi when he is the opposite, rather than make us tick, he slows down our play and contributes little else when he is on the pitch.

 

To be fair, Xavi was a late developer, as most playmakers tend to be. Xabi Alonso is another that comes to mind. Sweinsteiger, too.

 

Nail. Head.

 

Schweinsteiger wasn't really a late developer, he was an exciting winger for years and a first choice for Bayern. It is just that he has only recently become a deep lying playmaker rather than a winger, not so much a late developer as a player who has changed position.

 

The assist stat is easier to draw conclusions from because, for the most part, it involves 2 (or 3 at the most) players. At the end of the day, the assist goes to the person who was generally the most instrumental in providing the chance for the goal. This is especially true for corner kicks, and IIRC a few of Ki's assists have been from corners.

You are right though, there are a lot of variables for either figure. But these variables come in to play for more often if you are looking at a figure like percentage of wins whilst in the team. The assist rate is far more meaningful because it is far easier to draw rational conclusions from. The winning percentage figure involves so many different variables that unless all other things are equal, Ki's selection within the lineup cannot rationally be said to have had a conclusive impact on the game.

Obviously, if it's your opinion that Ki makes us a weaker team then that's fine but I think it's incorrect to say that the stats back it up.

You just repeated everything you've said previously, but with bigger words, and its making this debate a little boring. Your posts are getting repetitive. As for it being incontrovertible and irrefutable - well, that's clearly not the case, is it?

I don't think anyone has said anything like that.

 

Absolute codswallop, you evidence is not irrefutable, and it does not prove Ki is a liability in our team. It is one statistic you keep using to prove your point, yet at the same time you disregard another statistic about Ki being one of our highest assisters and goalscorer from midfield, do you see the hypocrisy there?

 

How about you both stick yer statistics up yer * and give the rest of us peace

 

Ahh i wish i could, alas i use statistics a lot at uni and they are completely subjective so its difficult for me not to argue when they are used definitively, ill try to stop now.:icon_mrgreen:

 

I wish I could know football as much as people do on here, but unfortuatley I'm not,
I just love football, it's the only sports which I have always liked since I was a kid, I just love the pure passions from the players, love the exciting moments when it scores, love the great movements and performances from the players and the team cheistry as well, love the players' pure tears and their honest efforts, the whole 90+ mins sometimes just seem so touching to my eyes. Watching them just makes me happy enough.

And also, I'm just the type of person who personally think encouraging words would be more important to, especially young players, rather than criticising too severely.

And to tell you the truth, some comments on here like "Go back to Korea, you ------" or "Asian imposter" or "Don't wear our jergey again" hurt my feelings too. I admit I could be too emotional but that's how I actually felt. And I actually couldn't understand why people keep saying Ki wouldn't ever be bigger in future, or he just can't succeed as a footballer. People might just predict the player's future and, well, he could succeed, or he could fail in future, but I ached in mind whenever I saw those comments. I just thought it would be good if fans wish him do well in future, even though they really don't like(rate?) him as a player. I just wished it, 'cos he is surely one of Celtic players. and because I thought sometimes just one warm supporting word from fans could give a good courage to young players like him to go on. But on the other hand, I could understand how everyone here love football and the club so much, so maybe, it might not that important matter, I think.

In my opinion, Ki has always been hot issue here, sometimes I wondered and get embarrased why there are so many posts when he's not even playing.
I wish he would stay here at least one more season, but I am also just afraid he would be critisied whether he stayed here or not.

It might not be enough for some fans but I truly think he has been trying very hard until now, especially this season, I guess he went through so many tough moments,

Some people say he is lazy, but I really don't think it's true. Not just Ki, but probably most foreign players, both on green and off the green, would try very hard and do their best to adjust and be accepted as a real part of the team, I personally think. And especially Ki is a international team pleayer so, I really think he had tried so hard.

Oh, and I saw someone even criticising his personality like being arrogant (?)
but I want to say ...please check if you're reading the fake Ki twitter or facebook,

'Cos one of the reasons I support Ki is ..his mental attitude both as a player and as a person, judging from all of his writings, even though I do not know him personally either,


The reason I write this is....

Maybe I'll be off the internet for several months(maybe until the end of this year) due to my personal schedule, (oh, I do know it's Never a important matter here but) I just wanted to say my honest feelings about this thread before I stay away from here for some while, I don't know what will happen in summer, but stay or not, I know and believe he has loved very much to be here, and I know he has tried very hard, and I just hope all this moments could be a precious foundation for Ki to develope into a bigger player than he is at the present,

and I do know I have no reason to say this 'cos I'm just a fan and no one to Ki, but I still want to say thank you so much to all the people who support Ki with warm eyes, I know this could sound some silly 'cos I have no reason to take this as personally but I have no other choice it's just how I've always felt.

and of course I will always support Celtic, and will come back here if my schedule come back to normal level (?) whether you like it or not,


...am just afraid it just turns out to be a weird post, haha....

Please understand the length and ..English:tongue2: in this post,


Cheers, everyone, Cheers, Celtic,

 

Yes many players are unpopular at first but then their talents are realised later on after a few years

I love Ki evry much

 

understood perfectly dont worry. hope to see you back on here when your not so busy, take care

 

Ki is far from a liability. He has a good passing range and has goals in him, too.

His weak point are the defensive side of the midfield game. People say he is lightweight and afraid of the tackle. I don't buy that. I've seen him crash into enough tackles to suggest he isn't scared of getting stuck in. He just lacks defensive intelligence. He is poor at tracking runners and his pressing and positioning need to be worked on.

But he is still, what, 23? In two years time he'll have developed more in terms of all-round game and will probably be heading to the World Cup. That would be an ideal time to sell him.

Having said that, if someone were to offer £8m+ this Summer I wouldn't mind the club taking it.

 

His defensive inabilities become a liability when the opposition are on the offensive.

 

ki is one of my favourite players .

almost never loses the ball too

 

How much do you think we could get if we sold Ki in the summer?

 

Because Ki has had a lousy season probably £4M tops